- Amendment 13
- Christine Dorchak
- Committee to Support Greyhounds
- Constitution Revision Commission
- constitutional amendment
- dog racing
- dog racing ban
- federal lawsuit
- Florida Greyhound Association
- GREY2K USA Worldwide
- Greyhound Nation
- Jack Cory
- Jeff Kottkamp
- Jennifer Newcome
- kennel owners
- Paul Hawkes
- Protect Dogs–Yes on 13
- race dog owners
- race tracks
The head of a pro-greyhound racing group now says supporters will file suit in federal court next month to “overturn” the constitutional amendment effectively banning dog racing in Florida.
Jennifer Newcome, who was chair of the Committee to Support Greyhounds, announced the move last Thursday in a public post on Facebook. It was on behalf of the offshoot “Support Working Animals” organization, online as Overturn13.org.
“With the abundance of information for (the legal team) to go through in order to prepare both the outline and body of the case, we are looking at filing in July,” she wrote. Plans for the lawsuit were first announced on YouTube.
Amendment 13, passed with 69 percent ‘yes’ votes in November, outlaws placing bets on greyhound and other dog races, such as at the state’s pari-mutuels, effective the beginning of 2021.
Many tracks already have stopped racing in the meantime; the measure allows other gambling at tracks, such as card games, to continue even after dog racing ends.
The amendment was placed on the ballot by the 2017-18 Constitution Revision Commission (CRC), as opposed to a citizen initiative or by the Legislature.
It was championed by then-Attorney General Pam Bondi, who also sat on the commission and regularly brought shelter dogs to state Cabinet meetings to get them adopted.
According to the Overturn13 website, the “greyhound industry in Florida, a legal trade and industry, was arbitrarily eliminated in Florida without proper ‘due process.’ ” Support Working Animals says it represents “trainers, adopters, kennel owners, workers, race dog owners and fanciers.”
“Some have said the CRC was the ‘due process,’ ” it continues. “But as we claim and the evidence CLEARLY shows, the outcome of Amendment 13 was predetermined by the illegal political process within the CRC.”
Requests for comment were sent to former commissioners and to representatives for the Florida Greyhound Association, which represents breeders and owners.
Jack Cory, the FGA’s Tallahassee-based lobbyist and spokesman, previously said that “overturning a voter-approved constitutional amendment is not a viable option in Florida.”
Christine Dorchak, president and general counsel, of Grey2K USA Worldwide, one of the anti-racing groups that fought for Amendment 13’s passage, called its approval the result of a “compassionate vote.”
Now, “months after the vote, a small number of greyhound breeders are now trying to undo the will of the people,” she said in a statement. “Their misguided lawsuit is a slap in the face of every voter and has zero chance of success. This is just sour grapes from a losing campaign.”
The Overturn13 website, however, says “Greyhound Nation did not back down before, and we refuse to stop until the last judge says ‘NO.’ “
Updated Monday — Newcome also sent this follow-up statement:
“We are an all volunteer group made up of adopters and greyhound racing enthusiasts working towards a legal solution to allow racing to continue in Florida. We want to protect the history of greyhound racing and also thereby preserve the unique American racing greyhound.
“Our supporters include adopters, some racing owners, some kennel owners, trainers, assistants and enthusiasts, as well as people who don’t even own any greyhounds, but own and work with other breeds and other working animals. We are standing up for the hundreds of hard working people who love these dogs and will lose their livelihoods and everything they love as a result of this Unconstitutional Amendment.
“We have found that many other animal entities have been slandered and victimized of the same misleading types of propaganda from the same entities who campaigned for passage of Amendment 13 and have since moved on.
“Our primary focus right now is the legal suit. We have retained a legal team who are preparing to rectify a situation that should not have happened in the first place. What drives us is a thought. We don’t want to wake up on January 1, 2021 and wonder what if we kept fighting for the greyhounds. Some may say we’re out of touch, or that the people have spoken, or that we’re grasping at straws.
“Well, we’re not letting go of those straws until they take us where we need to go in order to keep greyhounds racing in Florida.”
June 3, 2019 at 7:58 am
Well, I have to admit I thought you guys were just making this whole thing up. I mean it has been months now and tracks are already closing so your lawsuit will soon be moot anyway. Heck, even your buddy Jack Corey says it’s a no go. But if it keeps you from having to face the reality of Amendment 13 for a few more months, have at it. It’s your money.
June 3, 2019 at 9:08 am
Although you, Christine, and the rest of your paid lobbyists from grey2k and HSUS did your level best to deny American citizens their rights to due process, their right to make a living and their right to exist in the state of Florida, you evidently have no idea how this works. Your comment on its own tells me that you’re plenty worried about being exposed as the frauds, liars, and lobbyists that you truly are. As far as your wasting money comment goes, since when has it ever been a waste to fight for justice, win or lose? Get over yourself, Fred.
Man with Common Sense
June 4, 2019 at 1:58 pm
My god james your a moron lol. The free market decided a long time ago that greyhound racing is dead. The only reason it still existed in Florida was so casinos could operate. Now that they can operate without needing greyhound racing, there is zero demand for it. The casinos lost tons of money on greyhound races since surprise surprise, nobody cares about it.
Even if this gets overturned, there isnt going to be greyhound racing anymore. Its 2019, its not profitable. Start coming to terms that your dogs are going to be couch potatoes and that its not the 1970s anymore.
June 4, 2019 at 2:11 pm
Interesting how the misinformed sheep, when on the ropes, go right for the pejorative and ad hominem attacks. If you were so enlightened as to the free market then you’d know that line you just gave is completely false….although I don’t see where it has a single thing to do with what I said in my previous comment. I’ve long recognized that the entire vegan/AR/socialist community is full of narcissists who can’t hold civil discourse for long. Do sone real honest research on the viability of Greyhound racing and peddle your lies to someone who’ll believe them. There’s plenty of those in the state of Florida as we all now know. All they needed were bellwethers like yourself who follow and lead the rest.
James is mental
June 4, 2019 at 9:15 pm
Lol yeah im sure all those casinos that had greyhound racing and lost millions of dollars on it to keep their gambling are all just lying. They all voted against greyhound racing since they are all obviously communist socialist liberals with an agenda and none of it had to do with making more money….
June 5, 2019 at 10:18 am
“Man with no Common Sense” calling someone a moron really reflects bad on your opinion.
June 6, 2019 at 2:51 am
Isn’t it interesting that those with the inflammatory remarks are always the ones who won’t use those remarks with their real names attached. Can’t say that I blame this person as NONE of the casinos, in Florida, are associated with pari-mutuel wagering. Only card rooms, and slot rooms are. Get the facts right.
June 10, 2019 at 12:30 pm
I remember voting on that,i was for the dog racing, there was so much to vote on ,I might have voted wrong, most candidates wasn’t even marked Republican or Democrat. And yes that madders to me, and the wording on the amendments was confusing.
June 3, 2019 at 9:08 am
LOL sorry Freddie Cory is no friend of anyone. Again you can’t open your mouth without spewing garbage. Get your popcorn because certain friends of yours will not be able to lie in a Federal Court of Law, not even Christine will get away with it this time.
June 3, 2019 at 10:39 am
Oh, the joy its going to be watching you you fraudsters squirm on the stand, proven liar atheist infanticide party supporter Fred
June 3, 2019 at 11:26 am
The only fraudsters are the ones who race Greyhounds for blood money. Evil pricks.
June 3, 2019 at 11:46 am
Emjay, amazing that you are the only one whom needed to use profanity to try and convince people that your points are the only valid ones. Puts paid to the ignore button on any of your lying postings. LOL BTW, the Greyhounds run because they love it, gamblers bet on their performance because they love it. The Greyhounds are cared for better than many pets. Do get your facts straight 🙂
June 4, 2019 at 11:04 am
Oh yeah, I’m sure the dogs just love being coked up before racing. If I know there’s one thing my dog loves, it’s being dosed with drugs then made to race around a track after a defenseless rabbit. What’s more I’m sure the dogs love being abandoned by their owners once they can no longer race and instead passed along to rescue groups in the hopes that someone else will adopt them. Also prick is not a profane word, except maybe to you holier than thou supporters of animal abuse for profit. Honestly you need to just stop lying to yourself and others, supporting Greyhound racing was never about the dogs, it’s about the money.
June 4, 2019 at 1:11 pm
kierstin…for you ““You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” ― Harlan Ellison
June 7, 2019 at 12:27 pm
Hanna–That should be “who needed…”, not “whom needed…” Do get your grammar straight.
June 7, 2019 at 4:27 pm
Hannah, I agree with you. Those greys LOVE to run and yes, they are cared for better than many pets. I’ve seen many on their way to the track, barking cuz they’re anxious to do what they do. And leaving still barking, which my son and I thought was very funny. They just raced but they still want to race again…Let the dogs do what dogs do – R U N !! Hope Overturn13.org can do it. Show the FACTS of greyhound living and invite the public into the back scenes with trainers and owners that was overlooked the first time around.
June 3, 2019 at 9:11 pm
Fraudsters? It looks to me as if you are the only one here who isn’t using their real name. What are you hiding from?
Mary l Diaz
June 3, 2019 at 12:35 pm
While seeing what happens to these dogs after they are finished with racing and all the injuries they suffer afterward. I don’t want to see any more dog racing, no matter what they say how well they are treated most of them leave the track in very poor health just to please the money makers . This is any better than dog fighting. Let these wonderful animals just be pets they are such loving dogs and need to be adopted as any other dogs. I have come to know them now that my son and his girl have two of them and I see how they are are pets which I never knew they were just racing dogs just stop them from racing already its not a sport any more.
June 3, 2019 at 1:10 pm
Mary, contrary to what you are saying. The injury rate is less than one tenth of a percent. They leave the track in great shape. The ones that are making the most money off the dogs are the six full-time employees of Grey2k, which had revenue of $6 million and paid salaries of $2.4 million. The last time I checked neither Theil and/or Dorchak have a retired greyhound as a pet.
June 3, 2019 at 1:45 pm
I have four retired racers all that came to us in perfect health and well cared for. The worst injuries that they had have been the ones that have happened while adopted.
June 3, 2019 at 1:48 pm
I agree one of ours had a broken leg that should have had a plate put in instead of just writing “no previous injuries” on her file!! Ban this sport! And you don’t clean their teeth we do! Once they are done racing!
June 3, 2019 at 5:32 pm
I adopted a retired racer from US he broke his hock & the track looked after him, they put a plate, gave him therapy as a matter of fact the track would not release him to a adoption group until he was 100% healed & that took 7 months before releasing him. Now all say that’s 100% love & caring from the whole team that’s involved. My greyhound is not the first they do this with all of them & from what I see they are treated like gold from owner, kennel staff & trainers. When I picked up my black beauty, he came with all vet records, what his likes were & dislikes along with birth certificate copy of all his marking from head to toe & we have trainers name & owners name we are welcome back for a visit anytime and we all keep in contact. all this is because they are well loved & cared for.
June 3, 2019 at 2:11 pm
After greyhound racing is over after a couple years your son will never be able to get another NGA greyhound. Nobody will breed them to just give away.
June 3, 2019 at 2:18 pm
After greyhound racing is over after a couple years your son will never be able to get another NGA greyhound. Nobody will breed them to just give away.
June 3, 2019 at 3:46 pm
Mary…you have no idea what you’re talking about. I have adopted 2 retired racers. I got complete vet records for both from BIRTH! I even send pics to their former owners who still enjoy seeing their dogs. They are wonderful pets BECAUSE of how they are raised!!! People like you need to get your head out of the sand!
And while you’re at it, why dont you ask Grey2K what they have done to assist the greys since this passed?? Lemme tell ya….NOTHING!!!!
they took the money and ran!!!
June 3, 2019 at 9:42 pm
Mary, have you ever been in a racing kennel, or visited a breeding farm? Didn’t think so. Please speak only of what you know to be true, and not of what you’ve read or been told. Thank you.
June 4, 2019 at 11:59 am
There won’t be any greyhounds to have as pets if all greyhound racing is banned. The breed as we know it will cease to exist. Greyhounds aren’t bred as pets and even if they were, they aren’t the same as a retired racing greyhound. Likewise, an AKC greyhound is not the same dog as a retired racing greyhound.
I’ve adopted 6 retired racers and had many fosters and every single one of them came to me as a visibly well-cared-for dog. I visited a local kennel and met the kennel owners. They clearly cared for the dogs they bred and raised and all of the dogs there were friendly, happy and healthy. Saying racing greyhounds are abused, mistreated or not cared for is just not true.
June 4, 2019 at 8:47 pm
You are the problem thinking negative things about Greyhound racing. You are one of the ones that won’t get to adopt one because of your anti racing beliefs.
It is sort of biting the hand that feeds you,yet you want Greyhound racing to end and be one of the ones to adopt one.
June 3, 2019 at 11:01 am
Back kicking 3 year olds off the penny horse at Meijer again Fred! Face it the scam that Grey2k is will be exposed in Federal Court and it will be fun to see everyone squirm on the stand. I just might even bring some good Michigan beer and some popcorn to enjoy a front row seat.
June 4, 2019 at 12:26 pm
You actually believe the Federal Court system will “accept service” on a state constitutional amendment that passed through, and was validated by, the Florida State Supreme court and voter-approved and signed by the governor without objection? Care to describe the Appeals process on that? I have friends who are attorneys who actually smirked at what you are doing and are ashamed at what your attorneys are probably telling you.
June 3, 2019 at 8:20 am
Mr. Theil, I don’t understand your comment. “Greyhound breeders are being this litigation??” What does that mean? I am a greyhound lover, active with my adoption group and in no way associated with greyhound racing, and I wholeheartedly support the Overturn13 lawsuit. I have been to track kennels, talked to breeders, owners & trainers and have met the dogs and watched them interact with their caretakers. I have seen happy, healthy, well-socialized dogs being cared for by people who love their jobs and love racing greyhounds. I know that my retired racers are such wonderful pets BECAUSE of, not in spite of, the love and care they received at the farm & the track before I adopted them.
I also know that Grey2K deceived the Florida voters in the months prior to the election. The will of the people, to use Ms. Dorchak’s phrase, should be based on truth; Amendment 13 was based on out-of-date information, manipulated data, lies and, according to Circuit Judge Karen Gievers, “outright trickeration.” As such, it should never have appeared on the ballot.
June 3, 2019 at 10:59 am
Been involved in greyhound adoption since 1995. Founded a group after realizing the lies fed to the public and me, as an adopter.
These dogs make great pets because of how they are treated, with respect and love, not in spite of the treatment.
June 3, 2019 at 11:20 am
What lies? They are not treated well. Learn something.
mimi l dygert
June 3, 2019 at 11:56 am
The track dogs are well cared for. They are not abused & are retired to some 150 adoption groups that are approved greyhound rescues. What I feel a lot of people have been ” caught ” up in is the misinformation being spread by groups like Grey2K. Not unlike PETA these organizations are supported by the misguided public. People throw money at these large organizations feeling they are helping. It is an easy way out for the average person. Instead of really learning the truth. Animals do not perform if they are abused.
Mary Beth Constante
June 3, 2019 at 12:02 pm
What’s the incentive for abuse? A kennel’s income relies solely on winnings. Mistreated dogs don’t perform. They shut down or become aggressive. Happy, healthy hounds perform and are much easier to work with. So, it literally pays to treat them well.
Also, happy and healthy hounds get adopted easier. Greyhound adoption is successful because they make such great pets.
I work in a kennel. We love our hounds. I haven’t met a trainer that wouldn’t do whatever it takes to make their dogs thrive.
All of our dogs got shank bones on Monday for memorial day. We don’t race on Tuesdays, but on Wednesday, we won 6 out of 9 entries in the matinee card. Why? Because the dogs are happy and healthy. Bones clean their teeth and it’s a treat for them.
Use common sense. Mistreating what you rely on to feed your family and keep a roof over your head makes NO sense.
June 3, 2019 at 1:39 pm
You need to learn something… go see for yourself instead of believing the lies. These dogs are well cared for and treated well at the track. Common sense should tell you an athlete, such as these dogs, can’t perform is they were treated badly.
June 3, 2019 at 9:47 pm
Please detail the abuse you have seen and experienced first-hand….and I’m not looking for propaganda you have been fed.
June 3, 2019 at 4:19 pm
Well put, Sandi!
June 3, 2019 at 8:47 am
I want to wish these folks the best of luck with the lawsuit. Keep fighting the good fight to ensure the continuation of the American racing greyhound and to let these dogs do what they love. #RightTheWrong
June 3, 2019 at 11:25 am
You really are a special kind of ignorant, are’t you? (Rhetorical question.)
June 3, 2019 at 11:55 am
Jayem, are you really that special kind of stupid to believe the Grey2k lies? According to their 2017 tax return they took in just over $6 million and paid $2.4 million in salaries for 6 full-time employees (according to past arguments with Fred Barton). Who are the scammers and exploiters????
June 3, 2019 at 12:00 pm
Emjay, I am not ignorant. I am a greyhound adopter that decided I wanted to know about my pets’ lives before I adopted them. What I found was an entire community of people who love these dogs and want the best for them. You know what’s ignorant? Blindly believing the propaganda spewed by the animal rights extremists instead of finding out the truth for yourself.
June 3, 2019 at 5:26 pm
I totally agree!! I am not involved with racing, but I chose to see for myself about these gorgeous athletes and voted NO. It’s painful to see how so many people were duped into voting yes, because the propaganda out there is completely the opposite of how these dogs are treated. The people involved with their care are very passionate about them making sure their needs are met on and off the track. I’ve become a steadfast supporter and hope that this amendment can be overturned. It will truly be a sad day for the state and all sporting animals everywhere if this is allowed to stand. Best of Luck, Greyhound Nation!!
June 4, 2019 at 11:17 am
Oh yeah I love supporting lawsuits that go against the will of the voters. Face it, Floridians have voted to decide to end Greyhound racing. A lawsuit cannot change the fact that, like it or not, the public voted to ban these races. Just because your side lost that shouldn’t change the way constitutional amendments are passed. It’d be different if the legislature made changes to the amendment after it passed or were intentionally misinterpreting the intent of the amendment, but that is not the case here. Florida voted, the amendment passed, it’s over. Now if you really think that many people would support overturning the amendment, start a petition and get a new amendment on the docket before 2021 that will overturn the existing amendment. However, I will say that it’ll be highly unlikely to pass as the will of the voters has recently proven to be on favor of banning the races.
June 4, 2019 at 12:32 pm
Not to worry, a Federal Court cannot invalidate a state constitutional amendment that has been validated by the State Supreme Court and signed by the governor and added to the state constitution. Hundreds of attempted suits are set aside yearly because there is no legal process for consideration
June 10, 2019 at 12:17 pm
Actually, yes they can.
June 3, 2019 at 8:57 am
Here is the website for Support Working Animals and you can see the Overturn 13 site and Keep Greyhounds Racing site are both linked there.
Donations are always welcome and needed.
June 3, 2019 at 8:58 am
Yes, Mr. Barton, it is our money – money from people who love and care for these majestic athletes, the vast majority being adopters and hundreds of adoption organizations who are working to right this wrong that was based upon lies, information taken out of context, stolen and doctored photos, and millions of dollars in donations given by a duped public based upon high emotionalism.
June 3, 2019 at 8:59 am
We are all volunteers. Our board has not a single “breeder” on it. We aren’t “buddies” or affiliated in any way with other greyhound organizations or lobbyists. We are not being paid by anyone to do this. People are free to join us or not. We also have multiple people who don’t even own a single greyhound who have seen through the corruption which took place and chosen to help us fight. We appreciate all of their support. The main non-seasonal tracks are all fully operational and continue to be. Several seasonal tracks will also continue.
June 3, 2019 at 9:16 am
Greyhound Nation will not go down without exploring all options available legally to right this wrong. Let’s see what a US Circuit Court has to say about this sham of an Amendment and the Legal process that Florida implemented.
Let the dogs run !
June 4, 2019 at 11:26 am
How is the legal process a sham? A constitutional amendment was proposed and voted on by the citizens of Florida. Floridians overwhelmingly voted in favor of the amendment, as unlike most states, rather than a simple majority, amendments must pass by a threshold of 60% or greater.
June 4, 2019 at 5:58 pm
If it wasn’t a sham, why did Bondi and Lee flat out lie? Why did only ONE commsisioner make a kennel visit after hundreds of invittions were made. Why did the yes crowd have to use altered, stolen footage for their commercials?
We will see what the federal court says, it is clearly unconstitutional, ban greyhound racing but horse racing/jai alai is fine?
The CRC’s own bylaws say each amendment must be researched, one out of 37 visiting a kennel hardly qualifies.
June 3, 2019 at 9:17 am
I hope this is Semi-Speciesist law gets revoked. Animals deserve to be involved in sports and not just Humans. Not all Dogs have to be stereotypical lazy bums and couch pups.
Time to Overturn 13. No exceptions.
June 3, 2019 at 9:17 am
Well Fred, Is that the same mentality you apply to everything in your life? You realize that you will “miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.”
Hey Carey, maybe you should turn off the devices after you’ve been drinking.
June 3, 2019 at 9:19 am
If you want to know why this suit is being filed, read the CRC transcripts in their ENTIRETY from 3/20/18 AND 4/16/2018 A little insight, Bondi testified she had prosecuted greyhound abuse cases, there were NONE in the public records requests. Tom Lee references the Spectrum Report that erroneously stated the State loses money regulating greyhound racing, The DBPR told Chairman Beruff otherwise as well as recently the DBPR confirmed that the State did NOT lose $$$ on regulating Greyhound racing. They were able to snow the CRC, but when you read the transcripts, there is NO evidence to back up all the false stories promulgated in the CRC as there are many and it is now time to expose the liars. So either the CRC Commissioners were that stupid and did not do their job by verifying that they were lied to, or the FIX was in. Our legal system does NOT allow either scenario.
June 3, 2019 at 9:22 am
Ms. Dorchak’s comment “a small number of breeders,” etc. is as incorrect as their campaign slogans were. A lot more than that are still trying to get the truth to be heard. Racing greyhounds are treated well, fed well, and love to run. Ask anyone who has raised a greyhound puppy! Her “small number” of affected people is actually quite large. It is not only nearly all breeders, owners, and trainers, but also adopters, like myself, from the 102 adoption groups who have allowed and encouraged new owners to connect with those who raise and race greyhounds, realize these are people who simply love the breed, and make their living letting these dogs do what they love to do. And giving them good care during their short time at the track.
Those who voted to end the greyhound community in FL, did so based on $4 million of negative twisted ads. The greyhound community did not have that money because they don’t have a “Donate Button” on electronic ads every time a disaster happens. Then they use it lobbying instead of on animals. Where are spay/neuter programs? The money for those is spent lobbying! Remember that darkened photo of a red-muzzled greyhound with all the sad sayings on it? That was MY photo! That was a happy greyhound begging for a cookie while on turnout. They used it from Facebook without my permission for “public education.” That is not education, that is propaganda! Claims of drugging are also extremely exaggerated. Those who love this breed and do not want to see an end to it, have simply banded together to finally be heard. We are everyone who supports all working animals, who do not want those who put human ideology and desires in the minds of animals who simply want to do what is in their heritage to win this lob-sides, poorly worded amendment.
June 3, 2019 at 9:29 am
Well Christine, it is NOT sour grapes and what you did by snowing the people here in Florida with you 3 Million dollars of FALSE ADS was a “slap in the face” to Florida residents. I have talked to many, and when shown the TRUTH and see what a low life you and Grey2k are, would have voted otherwise. So get ready because YOU and your organization are about to be FINALLY exposed. And you can’t do a damn thing about it.
June 3, 2019 at 9:39 am
You see Carey,Christine and Fred…You cant even get your facts right in a public forum. No wonder you ran from every debate challenge or evidence inquiry.
June 3, 2019 at 9:44 am
I truly hope that the lies and mistruths that were presented to the voters of Florida will be exposed during the course of this litigation. As an adopted of retired racing greyhounds for the past 18 years – I was initially anti-racing. But over these 18 years I have learned the truth about racing. I’ve gone to tracks, kennels and greyhound farms, talked to trainers, veterinarians and kennel technicians. I now know that greyhounds are great pets because of the good care they got before, during and after their athletic careers. Thanks to everyone helping bring truth forward.
June 3, 2019 at 11:19 am
“Like” ^^ 🙂
Thanks for posting
June 4, 2019 at 12:47 pm
Nothing will be “exposed” as the federal court will not accept service on a state constitutional matter.
Some funny stuff flying around here by people guessing or hoping.
June 3, 2019 at 10:04 am
carey……another rational for you and your cronies to initiate a fundraiser…..the only thing missing is sobbing sonia…
June 3, 2019 at 10:08 am
This lawsuit is being bought and paid for by volunteers, that know the truth and love greyhounds, unlike some lobbing group that has to beg for donations for a copy/fax machine because they rather have the money go into their own pockets instead of equipment they say they need. WHAT A SCAM
June 3, 2019 at 10:09 am
It is very narrow-minded to believe that only greyhound breeders would have a love for greyhound racing. Adopters like myself have done their due diligence to research the sport, visit tracks, kennels & farms to see the love & care given to greyhounds and ask lots of detailed questions to understand what is going on. The few names who have brought negative limelight to the sport are not representative of the entire sport. In addition, greyhound racing outside of the US is not representative of it either. We support legal, responsible racing governed with regulation and oversight. The DPMW is the regulatory body of racing in FL. If there was the level of abuse and maltreatment that was talked about during the Amendment 13 campaign, then the FL Atty General, DBPR and Governor would have been investigating the failure of DPMW office upholding the laws & regulations that its office is tasked to carry out. But the office is not being investigated bec/ there was and is not rampant abuse; instead manipulated data & videos/commercials were the message of deception to the voters of FL and persuaded a vote. Many voters have come forward to express they believe they were deceived and voted irresponsibly. We can’t change how they voted but we can file our lawsuit & have a day in court.
June 3, 2019 at 10:46 am
This pretty much sums it up. Good post.
June 4, 2019 at 8:45 am
My dogs untreated broken leg begs to differ. Not the first grey I’ve seen with injuries from the track that weren’t economical to fix
June 4, 2019 at 9:30 am
Is your dog from China?
Or was it fixed by the track and then the injured it in your home.
June 4, 2019 at 10:09 am
From a track in Florida. I’m not going to say anything else on it. Believe me or don’t
June 7, 2019 at 3:30 am
I don’t. Well I believe he has a broken leg. I do not believe that rescue or the track didn’t do anything
Marsha C Abate
June 8, 2019 at 2:46 pm
I am very sorry for your dogs injuries. I adopted my first greyhound in Jacksonville 1970 I’ve had one pretty much ever since. At one point I was given a female and asked to breed her at least once and I could have the pick of the litter, I chose the puppy and I kept up with her racing the original owner of my her mother paid for all of her expenses and contacted me with up dates and winnings. Then nothing. No word. Found out after three months that she had shattered a front leg racing in Monticello, no one contacted me and they put her to sleep without my permission. They never contacted me!!
June 3, 2019 at 10:14 am
I’m supporting the greyhound racing both because the dogs live and love to run and because we need to draw the line in the sand against the animal rights activists. Their propaganda and marketing – first the elephants in the circus, then Sea World’s Orcas, and followed by greyhound racing – each victory brings them one step closer to shutting animals completely out of our lives. They have a long term strategy enabled and funded by the soft hearted people they have bamboozled with their false advertising.
June 3, 2019 at 10:22 am
Many of us who are in the dog world as active participants, and not Greyhound breeders, are supporting the reversal of amendment 13. We know that the propaganda that was all over the media was deliberately misleading with lies, misinformation and half truths, purposely presented in such a way to manipulate John Q Public. We know that dogs who participate in activities ( and racing is a highly regulated and inspected activity) are healthier and happier and make phenomenal pets when finished with their careers. We know that drugged animals, injured animals, unhealthy animals cannot perform whether it is dog shows, fast cat, lure coursing, K9 police/military work or Greyhounds who race. Lee, Bondi, and the various charities involved had their own personal agendas none of which were for the benefit of the dogs. Follow the money
June 3, 2019 at 10:35 am
Thank you Mr. Rosica for the coverage of the upcoming legal litigation to Overturn 13 and also the update from Jennifer Newcombe. Lies and doctored video tapes and photos by Grey2K and HSUS were used to put honest, hard working citizens of Florida out of work. Talk about taking away constitutional freedom! We will continue to fight for the Greyhounds and all working animals and their staff. We welcome like minded folks to join us in our fight for the basic rights and freedoms as afforded by the US constitution. http://www.overturn13.org Our fight has just begun!
June 3, 2019 at 10:37 am
My dogs (3 Shelties) and I shout, “HURRAY!” from WA state. I have never owned a greyhound, but I have known people who do and who work in greyhound rescue. (Grey2K USA Worldwide is not representative of the greyhound community in the USA. It is definitely not worldwide. It is a tiny, tiny group of haters with support from a big money animal rights group that hopes to end all dog ownership.) I have never participated in greyhound racing, but my dogs and I run agility. I know from experience what JOY it is for a dog to compete in a sport she loves. Win or lose, she gets praise and treats, but she knows when it’s a win and she celebrates accordingly. All anyone needs to do is LOOK at pictures of greyhounds racing to see the truth. There is no possible way to force a dog to run with that kind of intensity and delight. There is no possible way a mistreated dog COULD run like that. Just like a human athlete, those dogs have to have good food, comfortable rest, and a passion for their game to perform at that level. Only a truly cruel person who knows very little about dogs could even think of depriving greyhounds of their sport. Yes, three million dollars in false advertising paid off in the election, but it will take more than that to stop people who genuinely love dogs. HURRAY for the greyhound people! Right the wrong! #letthemrun
June 3, 2019 at 11:27 am
Thank you Vicki! When I see them run in person, and I see the intensity as they go by, it is amazing. I have never seen anything so fast, and it takes your breath away. After the race, they get their cool down bath, and I have been back there to see them. Not a sign of any mistreatment. The most fun I have seen on the track – a little girl named Zapper ran her race then kept going at Derby Lane a few months ago. She ran a second lap after which she earned the nickname, Zapper the Extra Lapper 🙂
June 3, 2019 at 10:06 pm
Thank you, Vicki Hurley!
June 7, 2019 at 1:04 am
June 3, 2019 at 11:03 am
Been involved in greyhound adoption since 1995. Founded a group after realizing the lies fed to the public and me, as an adopter.
These dogs make great pets because of how they are treated, with respect and love, not in spite of the treatment.
June 3, 2019 at 11:12 am
Success achieved through fraud, manipulation and big money should never go unchallenged.
It’s a shame that Grey2K et al, weren’t confident in or have enough respect for, the people of Florida to make their “choice” based on facts. Just goes to show how very shaky their platform really was.
I pray that their deceit is exposed and finally have to answer for it.
June 3, 2019 at 11:22 am
Can the real Carey Theil please stand up.
June 3, 2019 at 11:37 am
I use to be one of the sheep till I adopted my girl, then I investigated why if this girl was treated awful how could she be so loving and a total goofball. If trainers and owners didn’t care why would they easily volunteer information to a person they never knew. The trainers and owners of my greyhounds are involved in their lives even to this day.
Funny how Grey$k doesn’t even have an adoption kennel!
June 3, 2019 at 11:53 am
I am an adopter who has owned greyhounds, as pets, for nearly 30 years. I heard the lies, all those years ago, about the dismal, abusive life the racing greyhounds were subjected to. I decided to do my own research, rather than blindly follow what someone else wanted me to believe. What a novel idea! Make up my own mind, based on what I could see with my own eyes! I am disturbed by the number of people who refuse to do that, to include 36, of the 37, members of the CRC. I can tell you, from my own experiences, that a person can imagine what goes on in racing kennels and farms, but until they have actually been there, they don’t have a clue. Truly. Throughout the year that the CRC was traveling around the state, and researching the various Proposals, hundreds of invitations were extended to each, and every, one of them to visit a racing kennel or breeding farm. ONE Commissioner accepted, and visited a kennel. ONE!! The other 36 had no business debating, and casting votes, on something they had never seen for themselves. Period! They were given hundreds of opportunities, over a period of 365 days, to be well informed before making their decisions. Apparently, they didn’t see the importance of that, which is shameful. Lee and Bondi filled their heads with lies, and misinformation. These people were tasked with serious responsibilities to the people of Florida, and to say they “fell short” on this one would be a gross understatement. I have advocated for the greyhound racing industry for many years, and couldn’t be more thrilled to be a part of this movement to right the wrongs, as there are many. I know the truth, because I have BEEN THERE, and I have SEEN IT, which is more than any of the anti-racing people can say. See you in court, Dorchak. Don’t forget what you learned in law school about “perjury”. We are ALL watching you.
June 3, 2019 at 12:44 pm
Thereby not following their own bylaws, that in itself is reason to overturn 13
June 4, 2019 at 12:43 pm
You cannot remove a valid constitutional amendment just because you don’t like it or believe it got support because of lies. If that were the case, then EVERYTHING in the Florida constitution would be up for grabs simply by “saying so”.
Right there is enough to say go lick your wounds. It’s over dude.
June 3, 2019 at 12:02 pm
Carey, after all is said and done, don’t drop the soap!!!!
June 3, 2019 at 12:34 pm
Funny how Bondi never attended 1 CRC meeting held across the state, and Grey2k had he same people running around to each meeting repeating a script
June 3, 2019 at 2:29 pm
NO REALLY? A Script?????? Say it isn’t so https://www.facebook.com/grey2kisasham/videos/1714131388640910/
Abalonic Steriods anyone??????
Randie J Blumhagen
June 3, 2019 at 12:50 pm
THANK YOU for this wonderful article. THANK YOU to all the brilliant fact filled replies. I am so proud to be involved with this small army that is #GreyhoundNation. We will never back down and the world wide support from people who believe in us is so appreciated. The truth is on our side.
June 3, 2019 at 1:15 pm
I have adopted 10 greyhounds in the past 15 years. I am also a volunteer for 2 adoption groups. One outside of the State of Florida and One in Florida. Both groups have always received happy healthy dogs. The dogs are happy and healthy because they are selectively bred, cared for, schooled and loved by the their owners, breeders, trainers and racing community. They are great adoptable dogs because of their training and racing past. The Nay sayers have all been victim to old news about the racing industry and the tools that were used were just as antique. The reason they hold on to this old news is simple- MONEY! They went so far as to Doctor the truth by steeling photos and photo shopping them to make money. Grey 2 K and the HSUS are profit centers that need to support their payrolls. They offer less than 1% to help animals. They paid people (using donation money) to spew this awful propaganda. They are animal activists that hide behind Animal Welfare, that is how they make their living. Be educated and Don’t be fooled again!
It is truly sad that we may lose a breed of purebred athletes because the public is so susceptible to paid advertising & propaganda!
June 3, 2019 at 1:39 pm
I was so appalled to learn how groups like HSUS and Grey2K never had animals (in this case, greyhounds) best interest ay heart. They have clearly lied about so much just to get kind, caring people to donate. If you dig into their financials (check Guidestar.org and view it for yourself you can see how they spend their $$). They have continued soliciting for donations to “help the greyhounds” when racing is set to end and they will in actuality have zero contact or ability to even get these dogs. The dogs have owners and the greyhound groups already have long lists of people waiting to adopt them from the 102 Adoption groups who stand behind this lawsuit.
Ask yourself this- why are there so many volunteers and adopters supporting the reversal of this amendment? Because we all have seen the truth of their care before, during and after their racing careers. I, like many, started out anti-racing. I love dogs more than people. When I joined an adoption group I volunteered at my local track (over 16 years now!) and vowed to be the voice of these amazing greyhounds. I am doing that now by helping to right the wrong.
All of us tried to arrange kennel tours for the public but Pam Bondi and team had them stopped. Why? Because if the public saw the truth, they would find out all the propaganda perpetuated by these groups were lies.
The Florida voters have been lied to and it is time to stop the lobbyists (HSUS and Grey2k) who lie to line their pockets.
June 3, 2019 at 1:44 pm
I am proud to support the fight to right this wrong! I am an adopter and a volunteer in the adoption group and proud to stand for the hounds! These dogs are the amazing animals they are because of how they are raised and the love and care they receive from everyone! I have been to the farm, to the kennels and to the track. I chaired the annual fundraiser for our adoption group this year at the racetrack. We had over 40 retired racers that joined us for the event and the pictures don’t lie, the dogs had a blast from the moment they walked in the front door of the track until the night ended. Abused dogs don’t get so excited they can’t stand still at the site of the so called abuse. I challenge the public to surf the public greyhound forum where adopters can interact with the trainers and kennel staff and see the knowledge and live that is shared! These dogs have a 98% adoption rate with the 2 % being those dogs that end up remaining with the owner or trainer. I challenge any animal shelter to match that success rate! This amendment was put in front of the voting public with old outdated statistics, misrepresentation and flat out lies! The language used on the ballot was inflammatory and very very misleading. We will not back down and we will fight on behalf of the dogs, the owners, the trainers, the kennel staff and every single person that contributes to making these amazing WORKING Animals! I encourage everyone to get educated and get off the sidelines and join the fight in overturning 13! PETA, HSUS and Grey2K are nothing more than lobbiests they give nothing to the dogs nor any of the other animals they want to “protect”. Go look at their annual operating statements, the numbers don’t lie! Get ready PETA, HSUS and Grey2K, the dogs are coming for you! #LetThemRun #GreyhoundStrong #Overturn13
June 3, 2019 at 1:53 pm
The greyhound owner’s, trainers and advocates that I have come to know over the past year should be celebrated for the love and caring they provide these dogs not kicked to the curb by this state. I do not own a greyhound but I actually got off my duff and learned the “truth” with my own eyes before making up my mind about the very biased CRC proposals. I refused to listen to people sprouting peta and Hsus propaganda whose true agenda is to remove all animals from our lives. Shame on GOP’s who I “thought” believed in freedom of choice and due process but instead choose votes and money. Every single one of you – From Pam Bondi to Tom Lee to Dick Scott, you should have your republican status removed and rode out of office on a tarred and feathered broomstick.
I support the people of Greyhound Nation 100 percent in this legal endeavor and I wish them much success in beating back this subculture of human hate pretending to be animal protectors. GREYHOUND STRONG!!!
June 3, 2019 at 2:06 pm
Are Being this lawsuit? Proper sentence structure is awesome
June 3, 2019 at 4:23 pm
Clearly a typing error! The word that you could not apparently come up with because of lack intelligence is “BEHIND”!
June 3, 2019 at 4:35 pm
Gary, if I substitute your word into Carey Theil’s comment, it would read,”Dorchak claims ‘greyhound breeders’ are BEHIND this litigation. She is wrong. Greyhound lovers is far closer to reality.” Is that how you interpreted his statement? If so, then I concur that greyhound lovers ARE behind this lawsuit. The people supporting and contributing to the effort to #Overturn13 are indeed lovers of racing greyhounds. Thank you for clarifying the very point that most of us are trying to make!
June 3, 2019 at 2:08 pm
All greyhound people worldwide who truly care about the breed will support our Florida friends in their lawsuit. We have ALL been the victims of Greed2k’s propaganda and those of their offshoot animal rights and extremist groups who exist elsewhere, all telling the same lies and misinformation wherever they go to whoever will listen and whoever is gullible enough to believe these scammers with giant donate buttons without seeing for themselves. I and many others look forward to seeing all the liars on the stand being asked to account for their actions and to prove their propaganda-please can someone record it so it can be seen worldwide? Here’s to getting justice for our superb canine athletes and righting hat wrong!
June 3, 2019 at 2:15 pm
I’m still amazed the media failed to recognize the initiative was financed and orchestrated by out of state lobby groups, whose sole intent was to destroy the livelihoods of hard working, tax paying Floridians. They provided no provisions for the aftermath of this passing, with all victims of this action whose jobs and livelihoods were to be lost, just simply collateral damage, along with the greyhounds themselves. How do I know? In the bill, how much money was set aside for the greyhounds if this was to pass? Not 1 cent…It was never about the greyhounds….
June 3, 2019 at 3:31 pm
You mean like when a urine sample was proven to have been tampered with on Tony Glovers watch at the DBPR, then he quit to go Lobby for Grey2k, and the sample sent to the independent lab was found to NOT have ANY canine DNA and the 300+ media outlets sent that story ignored it??????
June 3, 2019 at 2:21 pm
I am a Greyhound owner in Australia, (adopted 6months ago) and I really do believe that these dogs are cared for & treated well, in the majority of kennels all around the world. The evidence is clearly there of that fact.
An issue which I can’t get past in my own mind, is the alarming number of greys that are euthanised every year in this industry.
Is there a better explanation of why this happens? (Other than the assumption after reading up about it, is that there are many that suffer injuries that mean they cannot go back to race/ or the fact there are too many retired greyhounds compared to the number of people who want adopt them).
June 3, 2019 at 3:03 pm
Julie, that might be the case in Australua, but certainly not here in the US. American racing greyhounds enjoy a 98% rate, with the remaining 2% going home with owners, trainers or on to breed. Currently, there are more applicants wanting to adopt, than available dogs.
June 3, 2019 at 2:42 pm
It was never just about the dogs, the issue is so much more complex. I do so hope the industry is able to win in court. The joy of seeing a dog running, is so self evident.
June 3, 2019 at 4:58 pm
Oh really! Wow, so 98% are good enough to race & the other 2% go to being pets etc. That’s awesome!
So the 98% that race, what age do they retire & what happens then?
Sorry for all the questions. I’m just learning about all of this 🙂
June 3, 2019 at 5:54 pm
Julie, I don’t actually know what percentage of racing greyhounds that are born in the US actually go on to race. At about 18 months, when they finish their schooling, they run in what are called maiden races. If they do well enough in those races, then they continue racing. My understanding is that the dogs can continue to race til they’re about 5 but many retire earlier than that. Any dogs that don’t do well in their maiden races just get sent to the adoption kennels; I’ve had foster dogs straight from the track that aren’t even 2 years old and others that are 5 years old. What Renee Leslie meant by her statement is that, when they retire from racing, 98% are adopted – they are either placed in homes by their racing owners or they are sent to adoption groups throughout the US & Canada that are focused solely on finding homes for retired racers. The other 2% stay with their racing owners, to be brood moms, studs, and/or pets. They truly are “Born to Race, Fueled by Love,” from the farm, to the track, to the couch!
June 3, 2019 at 9:34 pm
Julie, what she meant was that the adoption rate for these dogs, in the USA, is 98%. 2% go home to live with owners and handlers when they retire. In a perfect world local shelters would have these statistics. Sadly, in Florida alone, there are hundreds of pets in animals shelters that are euthanized DAILY. That fact doesn’t bother the so-called “dog protectors” because there are no gaming laws or $$$ attached to those poor souls.
June 4, 2019 at 12:16 pm
You’re right, it’s about the money. Who stands to lose money once Greyhound racing is banned? Breeders, trainers, kennels, racetracks, “rescue groups” associated with the racetracks and kennels”, and gamblers. Certainly not dogs though. Immediately following the ban rescue groups will have an influx of greyhounds that need homes. Once the rescue groups find forever homes for the greyhounds they would then be able to focus their efforts on finding forever homes for the other thousands of dogs lingering in shelters across the state. Furthermore, even if greyhound reaching is banned, the breed will continue to be bred, just like all of the other breeds of dog not involved in the sport, just not as prolifically as they are now. Even further, it’s not like the dogs are completely banned from running ever again, just not for money.
June 4, 2019 at 12:33 pm
Kierstin, you are free to rescue whatever type of dogs you want. What you don’t seem to understand is that a very large majority of greyhound adoption groups (not rescues) are made up of volunteers who do it because they love retired racing greyhounds. As far as I’m concerned, they are the best dogs around and I can’t imagine not having them in my life.
June 4, 2019 at 1:14 pm
As I’ve already stated, just because gambling on greyhound racing will be banned come 2021, that doesn’t stop people from continuing to breed and adopt greyhounds. Nor does it stop the dogs from running, only from running for a profit. They can and will continue to be in your life regardless of the legality of racing. I also have only ever adopted animals from shelters and will continue to do so rather than support people breeding animals for profit, so thanks for giving me permission I guess.
June 3, 2019 at 2:47 pm
I have adopted this greyhound breed for 28 years. Back in 1990 I had the opportunity to visit kennels and over the years visited two other kennels in different states. They were well cared for and loved. I saw no abuse. Dogs were happy and playing when “turned out”. It’s not the dog racing that is the problem. It’s the people who “oppose” racing by making false claims for their own personal gain. Whether it be for making money by lobbying against racing or the attention gained by those against it even though they know nothing about it. The biggest hypocrite of them all is the legal education of C. Dorchak. Ask her how she was able to obtain her law degree and who helped her? Shame, shame on you for back stabbing a wonderful person who loved helping people. Unfortunately, he helped the WRONG person, one of Satan’s spawn. Karma has a way of catching up to people who abuse those of a good nature. I’ll be sitting on the sidelines cheering Overturn #13 when your day of reckoning arrives. You have deceived far too many people for too long. Keep Greyhounds Racing.
June 3, 2019 at 3:24 pm
In the 80s I had swallowed the koolaid about GH racing. Fortunately by the mid 90s I had an eye opening experience that forever changed my thinking. I came to know an adopted Greyhound named Bingo… with whom I fell in love. The owner of Bingo, through a set of fortunate circumstances, was in the process of starting a Greyhound breeding farm and over the next 22 years, I came to 1…. love the breed. 2… meet tons of people in the industry,… had my first racer at a track in FL… and brought home a retired Greyhound to live with me. I managed a Greyhound farm with over 70 dogs.. that were VERY well cared for, Very WELL fed.. and Very LOVED. I whelped many litters, and held many minute old pups, helping them to start breathing and to nurse. I sent off many young pups for finishing training each year, and then sent them to racing kennels, to watch them do WHAT THEY WERE BRED TO DO. RACE> I found myself immersed in an industry that felt the same way that I did.. but we were also the target of animal rights activists that were determined to end this sport, that I now find myself fighting for. (That was New England) and we were “out moneyed”.. and out lied… So to see it happen again in FL has put me on the path to finally RIGHT THE WRONG that was done almost 20 years ago.. and I am fighting the same money hungry, lying groups as before.. BUT now we are ORGANIZED, and even have the ear of some good media folks (Thank you Jim Rosica). and MANY MANY people from outside the industry to help us fight and EDUCATE the voters in Florida. I am NOT wearing rose colored glasses… I am seeing a clear path for us all to walk down TOGETHER.. and hopefully, the courts and our legal team will make this happen !! If you have read all these posts, and the original article.. and have understood.. then JOIN US at Overturn13.org, KeepGreyhoundsRacing.org and SupportWorkingAnimals.org.
June 3, 2019 at 4:56 pm
The state constitution has been legally amended by a democratic vote of the citizenry. Reversing that amendment would require a further constitutional amendment.
The courts have no power to amend the constitution.
You do the math.
June 4, 2019 at 11:44 am
Yeah I don’t understand why anyone thinks this lawsuit stands a chance. Whether the public was “duped” as greyhound racing supporters like to claim, or if the CRC was lied to as they also like to claim, the amendment was voted on by the citizens of Florida and passed. A lawsuit won’t change that.
June 4, 2019 at 11:49 am
Federal law TRUMPS state law, lawyer wanna be
June 4, 2019 at 12:58 pm
Andy – care to cite the clause of the constitution that states that? Better check Article X of the US Constitution.
Anything not specifically prohibited or allowed in the federal constitution is controlled by the state constitutions.
This challenge won’t be accepted by the federal court as it is a state issue (but your lawyers will still get their cash!)
June 3, 2019 at 5:02 pm
You know, after those arguments went no where for you in the campaign I’d have thought you’d quit beating that dead horse. You called us liars and frauds all through the campaign and no one believed you (well, 69% didn’t)so either you folks are really, really bad at telling the truth, or the voters saw through you.
June 3, 2019 at 5:06 pm
Yeah, well, like I said, it’s your dime, but that money probably could be put to better use helping adoption groups, or your fellow workers as they transition out of the industry.
June 3, 2019 at 10:15 pm
And how much is Grey2k helping???? Heaven forbid Carey and Christine take a pay cut…. How about you donate part of tour salary Freddy boy????
June 4, 2019 at 9:08 am
Don’t you dare have the audacity to say where we, THE ADOPTION COMMUNITY, should put our money! You know how many dogs G2K’s bank account could support? This is the dumbest comment from a g2k board member I’ve ever read! You should be ashamed. If g2k gave every penny they’ve solicited from donors, we might not have shelter dogs dying everyday!
June 4, 2019 at 1:22 pm
What does the legality of greyhound racing have to do with shelter dogs? Greyhound racing does nothing to support shelter dogs or help them to get adopted. Adoption groups that support greyhound racing work with retired greyhounds, not shelter dogs. Though if there were no more greyhound races these adoption groups could then be able to use their resources to help shelter dogs.
June 4, 2019 at 2:44 pm
Greyhound adoption groups are greyhound adoption groups. Hence the reason you will never see a greyhound in a shelter. An adoption organization would have that dog out in 2 hours or less. As for me, a greyhound it is – a retired racer – or nothing. I simply will not have a dog.
June 4, 2019 at 5:32 pm
I understand that. My comment was in response to someone who said “If g2k gave every penny they’ve solicited from donors, we might not have shelter dogs dying everyday!”. To which I replied “What does the legality of greyhound racing have to do with shelter dogs?” But I’m glad that you are showing your true colors in that you don’t care about dogs in general, just about your coveted racing dogs.
June 4, 2019 at 9:38 am
And yet, they are many of the persons donating to the cause. Thanks for the financial advice though
June 3, 2019 at 5:08 pm
Stevie! Nice to know you’re still out there knocking around. So Jack is a bad guy now, huh? Seems I remember he was one of your top guys during the campaign. You folks wouldn’t be turning on one another after getting beat now would you?
June 3, 2019 at 6:45 pm
LOL Fred, again no clue Freddy. The FGA NEVER endorsed, helped, or donated to the CSG, but hey why would you ever let a fact get in your way. The stuff is going to hit the fan and neither you or your two sidekicks are going to like it. NO ambulance chaser Amicus briefs, no favors owed to Bondi, just the facts and the law, two things you and your sham of an organization have no concept or respect for.
And speaking of money, the 3 Million you put into all the fraudulent ads could have done WAY more good in other places then our piddly 40 grand in lawyer fees thus far, but again when did you ever promote a shred of a truth.
June 3, 2019 at 5:10 pm
Each track covered up the dumping of dead dogs. covered up the steroid use. covered up the overly small cages these dogs are kept in for hours at a time. The least transparent business I’ve come across in a long time. I’ve seen the photos. I’ve seen the videos. Yeah, sure, you care about your money making machine. Got it.
June 3, 2019 at 7:00 pm
You have been lied too.
June 4, 2019 at 1:06 pm
Nobody “lied to” me when I personally saw the mass dog graves at Wonderland and others. Care to deny what REALLY happened not too many years ago (until pressured to stop)?
June 4, 2019 at 9:18 am
You do realize that this organization is made up of mostly greyhound adopters don’t you? No breeders or kennel operators are on their board. It is strictly greyhound enthusiasts who have zero financial interest in greyhound racing. 102 greyhound adoption groups urged VOTE No on 13. That should speak volumes.
June 4, 2019 at 2:48 pm
I have seen pictures of Elvis alive and videos of big foot. Were those real too?
June 3, 2019 at 5:10 pm
Well, like I said, it’s your dime, but I think that money could be better spent helping adoption groups, or your fellow workers as they transition out of the industry.
June 3, 2019 at 5:27 pm
While grey2k solicits donations for a new copier, once a fraud always a fraud.
June 3, 2019 at 8:09 pm
and Greed2k can buy their own copy machine without having to beg for donations for one, what a scam, I guess the pocket book is more important for them
June 3, 2019 at 5:11 pm
Sixty nine percent of the voters thought we got our facts right.
June 3, 2019 at 5:15 pm
You don’t deal in facts, 69% of the voters were taken in by your lies, proven liar atheist Fred. Let’s see what happens when Bondi, Lee, Dorchak and his wife Carey is on the stand…. UNDER OATH. You are still lying scum.
June 3, 2019 at 8:11 pm
3 million dollars worth of lies can fool a lot of people
June 3, 2019 at 5:14 pm
You’re making a pretty big assumption there Andy boy. You folks still have a few hoops to jump through before you get to a trial.
June 3, 2019 at 5:17 pm
That’s right, first comes injunction, which will stop implementation of your scam amendment
June 4, 2019 at 3:01 pm
Andy. Your comment about an immediate injunction is actually displaying how far off-base you are. Nothing is required to happen until Dec 31, 2020. More than likely every Florida race track will stop racing dogs by then. They want to stop, many have already stopped! Most tracks around the country have stopped for financial reasons, not legislative reasons. Both of these reasons should help you understand the futility of your situation.
June 4, 2019 at 3:24 pm
Oh really, I guess that is why quite a few tracks have publicly said they will run until the end, because they will stop before then. You lying scammers seldom get your facts straight. Some wanted to stop, but not all. God willing we get your lying scam vegan heroes on the stand.
June 3, 2019 at 5:15 pm
Don’t pop the popcorn yet Craigie boy. You’ve still got a ways to go before a trial.
June 3, 2019 at 6:12 pm
I see that you found a few pennies on campus Fred, good for you. Face the facts your organization didn’t plan on a Federal Court challenge. In Federal Court lies will be exposed and hopefully the leaders of your organization will face charges for perjury and fraud. Your organization can afford $2.4 million for salaries of 6 full-time employees, but cannot afford a copier, sounds like your organization is exploiting the dogs for profits. Your organization was successful in duping 69 percent of Florida voters, which many have voters regret about how they voted on 13.
June 3, 2019 at 5:19 pm
Andy, you made all these accusations before, and you lost. I’m not going to argue them again.
June 3, 2019 at 6:50 pm
That’s cause dirty money won, and facts did not Fred. again will be proven win or lose the suit. You just don’t get it. But you will.
June 4, 2019 at 5:25 am
Not accusations, all true, and yes we were out spent 30-1. Interesting you don’t care to mention the 2.4 million in salaries brought up by Mr Laginess, nor do you seem to wish to discuss the shameless plug for a new copier. Could just be your criminal group receives their comeuppance this time.
June 3, 2019 at 5:35 pm
Natalie!!!! I adopted a retired racer from US he broke his hock & the track looked after him, they put a plate, gave him therapy as a matter of fact the track would not release him to a adoption group until he was 100% healed & that took 7 months before releasing him. Now all say that’s 100% love & caring from the whole team that’s involved. My greyhound is not the first they do this with all of them & from what I see they are treated like gold from owner, kennel staff & trainers. When I picked up my black beauty, he came with all vet records, what his likes were & dislikes along with birth certificate copy of all his marking from head to toe & we have trainers name & owners name we are welcome back for a visit anytime and we all keep in contact. all this is because they are well loved & cared for.
June 4, 2019 at 10:07 am
That doesn’t change my experience. I saw the xrays. I’ve worked with several x racers
June 4, 2019 at 2:51 pm
Really? Which ones? Where? Where are all these “x” racers?
June 3, 2019 at 6:13 pm
Good luck with this and I hope you win. The lies spread by Grey2K and their supporters need to be exposed. the dogs need to be allowed to do what they love and race. Please also keep retired racers out of the hands of the anti racers. They dont deserve a single dog after they crap they have been spreading.
June 3, 2019 at 7:14 pm
I am proud to stand beside the hard-working, dedicated men and women, greyhound racing professionals and adopters together, in the fight to right this tremendous wrong. Wrong on so many levels. Constitutional issue? No. The CRC process? A corrupt charade. In fact the body itself is now rightfully being called into question.
This never should have been placed on the ballot, and certainly not in the manner in which it was presented. “Outright trickeration”!
So yes, we fight on for our greyhounds and the people who live, love and care for them. Against lies, deceipt, corruption, fraud, dark money and total mockery of the intentions of those who created this great nation with the intent that all its citizens are endowed with the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. #GreyhoundNation #RightTheWrong
June 3, 2019 at 8:48 pm
Having been within both the Greyhound racing and adoption communities for more than 20+ years, I have come to know and love both ends well. I have watched and followed Greyhounds from birth, knowing they would be coming home to me at the end of their racing career. I have watched them grow and train and visited them and watched their career with great enthusiasm. I have also adopted pups who flunked racing college (no, they were not killed for being slow or uninterested in racing) as well as taken in several who needed a place when their adopter could no longer care for them. I will support those that have raised and raced these wonderful hounds then entrusted me with their retirement. The Greyhound racing community has given me the most well adjusted pups that are the way they are because of how they were raised and cared for. What I will never support are the (hookers and pimps) politicians and lobbyists who have tried their hardest through money and lies to deceive the people of Florida and to to destroy the lives of both people and hounds through their fallacious and distorted need and greed. Follow the Grey$Greed and the HSUS money and then the truth will come out.
June 3, 2019 at 9:15 pm
Whoever you are, you are not Carey Theil. He writes beautifully and does not refer to his wife ad Dorchak.
June 4, 2019 at 5:16 am
He is the wife. dorkchak is the husband, and they are both scammers, and they both will be exposed on the stand.
June 3, 2019 at 9:36 pm
Maybe that was part of your problem. You folks were supposed to be on the same side.
June 3, 2019 at 10:08 pm
This is my first and last to you – You have no power here. Be
gone, before somebody drops a kennel on you!
June 3, 2019 at 10:27 pm
I first heard about extreme animal rights activists, known as Grey2K, who introduced themselves in the early 90’s in a Canadian newspaper by posting a deplorable article grossly outlining the abuse and neglect of American racing greyhounds. That same year I adopted my first greyhound from Hinsdale Race Track in New Hampshire. That greyhound was pure joy and love .. no way was he abused.
Going forward, now with over 26 years of being involved in both Canada and the States with adoption groups, fostering, visiting race tracks and dog farms, adopting 11 greyhounds of my own, I never saw any of these sick allegations of abuse. With Florida’s 2018 election and inclusion of Amendment 13 (which was initiated by the CRC including some members who were also activists), Grey2K and their bed fellows, PeTa and H$U$, spent millions of public donated dollars on duping the Florida public with lies and deception to destroy the livlihoods of respectful and compassionate hard working men and women and their greyhounds. Greyhound Nation speaks the truth about the greyhounds from birth to racing to adoption and when you speak and live the truth, you don’t have to stoop to a low life of ignorance and disrespect to execute your agenda. #GreyhoundNation, #RightTheWrong
June 3, 2019 at 10:57 pm
I love the fact that only 1 out of 10 posts are from greyhound supporters. I too believed that greyhounds were horribly abused. I know there were a few bad apples in the bunch 20 years ago but there is in everything. They were punished and banned. The greyhound industry is so tightly regulated now because of people like that. The greyhound nation changed for the better over the last 20 years but grey 2k saw the purse strings open from every bad thing they could spout about greyhounds. The time has come to cut those strings and put them behind bars for fraud. May the greyhound nation prevail!!
June 3, 2019 at 11:16 pm
I meant 1 out of 10 posts are from non greyhound supporters. Shows tee live and passion of this group
Pro animal society
June 3, 2019 at 11:23 pm
I find it ordinary that the same groups trying to shut down greyhound racing are even trying to take meat off our tables … vegans are harassing our farmers trying to shut down our zoos and aquariums … these humaniacs are after one thing to ruin the human and animal bond … they don’t care who they stomp on… on their way to the their glorious donate button scheme !!! … peta and company has harassed thousands of animal enterprises world wide its time to fight back and take our country back from the vegan nutjobs !!!
June 4, 2019 at 5:18 pm
So, in your opinion, factory farms enhance the human – animal bond? In what way does pumping animals full of antibiotics and/or steroids, cramming them into cages so small they can’t turn around, and slaughtering them, many times while the animal is still conscious, enhance the human-animal bond? Further, how does racing an animal for profit enhance the human-animal bond?I will concede that zoos, aquariums, and theme parks like SeaWorld and Busch Gardens can help enhance this bond as they help expose people to animals they would never normally see otherwise, in addition to the great work they do rehabbing and researching the animals in their care. However, factory farms do not enhance this bond, no one gets to see and interact with these animals, they just eat them after they have been subjected to a life of cruelty. In the same manner greyhound racing does nothing to enhance this bond, at least no more than simply owning a pet. People care about greyhound racing for one reason, and one reason only, money. The dogs can still be bred, adopted, and even run, just not for money.
June 4, 2019 at 5:28 pm
Oh, so the alphabet soup vegan scammers don’t care about money, I guess that’s why they pay themselves exorbitant salaries, such as grey2scum 2.4 mil for 6 people in one year, and give at most 2 percent to help any animal. You people are parasites, simple as that.
June 4, 2019 at 5:45 pm
Lol I’m no vegan, nor am I rich in any sense of the word, but I refuse to support animal cruelty. It’s definitely scammy for an organization to pay themselves exorbitant salaries yet only donate a fraction of their money to the animal/people/organization they claim to help. However, this bill, whether bankrolled by a dishonest organization or not, was passed overwhelmingly by the citizens of Florida. A lawsuit cannot change that, federal or not. If you claim otherwise, show me where in the Constitution that it says the federal courts have to power to usurp a State’s constitutional amendments regarding laws that aren’t laid out specifically within the Constitution, as last I checked the Constitution says nothing on the legality of dog racing. The people who voted in favor of this ban do not stand to make any money, however those who oppose the ban stand to lose a lot of money once the ban goes into effect.
June 5, 2019 at 9:41 am
Kirstin, you seem to be forgetting all of the greyhound adopters who oppose this ban. We don’t stand to lose any money. This should never have been on the ballot. Why should people who know nothing about greyhounds or greyhound racing or who have never even met a greyhound be voting on their futures?
June 4, 2019 at 9:04 pm
Kierstin, while I respect your opinions, I’d like to put forth mine to you. I”m old, old enough to remember the days when Greyhounds that were no longer viable to race or breed were killed and put into mass graves. Why, because the owners couldn’t find anyone to adopt them. Then the 1990’s rolled around and GPA was formed, by those awful dog owners, as a way to rehome their athletes. This has snowballed into over 300+ Greyhound specific adoption groups in the US and Canada. Many, many owners now pay at least a portion of the costs for any Gh that they send to groups. Over the last 30 years we can boast a 98% adoption rate with the rest going back to the owners/farm. No other purebred dog group has those kinds of stats. Greyhounds also don’t clutter up shelters and if there is one dropped off there by an irresponsible owner, as soon as it’s found out, the local group will pull it. Those cramped cages are larger than what pet Greyhounds are put in while their owners work 8-10 hours a day. They are fed healthy foods, specifically so as an athlete, they are in top shape nutritionally. The dogs are turned out many times per day, have sprint training, are walked, groomed, they are cooled down after 30 seconds of running, then they go back to the kennel for a snack & nap. The staff is on site, caring for the dogs from about 4:30 AM to 11PM. It is exhausting, back breaking work. I’ve been in race kennels, you can eat off the floors after turnout, after all the pups are back in their houses and the continuous all day cleaning continues. The farm schedule is the same with the exception that the dogs are in long runs. If you’d like to educate yourself, check out the Darren Henry Kennels, North Shore Kennels, Kathi Lacasse, AJ Grant, Paint the Trail ect. You’ll get real time, live videos of the Greyhounds throughout their day. You’ll see pictures and videos that haven’t been stolen, darkened, with sad music & memes to misrepresent the facts. People love sad stories & will donate more when they see them, as spoken by many anti racing folks, starting with G2K.
Also, you need to understand contracts that have to be fulfilled by a race kennel, as dictated by a track, that a certain number of Greyhounds must be available to race at any time. FB – Greyhound Guru and mentor Dennis McKeon has written many articles explaining every facet of Greyhounds from birth to track to retirement. He’ll tell you about the walk out in 1975, that failed and he lost his job as trainer. A more honest man you’ll not find.
As to your comments about the animal husbandry industry, if you’d like to educate yourself, check out TDF Honest Farming on FB. Their videos disprove your statements. Then there is the Cavalry Group, Sportsmen’s and Animal Owners’ Voting Alliance, and similar groups whom are fighting every day to safe guard animal welfare, which is totally different than animal rights, animal zealots whom do nothing to promote & educate humane animal care.
What does this have to do with the present legal litigation that will be filed next month in FL? Everything…. we are fighting for the good people that love and care for their animals and do the very best for them. While some many not agree with that statement, I’d suggest you walk an 18 hr day in their shoes, for a solid 7 days in a row, give up your child’s birthday party or every holiday because the dogs depend on you to care for them. Do all that, then we can talk.
Greyhound adopters and groups are supporting this litigation. Those boots on the ground that have seen every aspect of the sport of Greyhound racing. These people work, have families and still make time to fight for the Greyhounds. No the sport isn’t perfect, yet each year we help to make things better. The opposition just wants to ban everything they don’t like. We don’t have any Doris Day’s giving us millions to lie & deceive the general public. All we have is the truth on our side and win, lose or draw, at least we can proudly say we did all we could to protect the sport of Greyhound racing, their staff and future generations of racing Greyhounds. There is so much information online, those that care will look at both sides, do their own research, make up their own minds, not swallow whatever handy kool aide shows up in their news feed. While I’ve no delusions of changing your mind, I challenge you & anyone else that reads this post to follow the links, links to honest, upstanding, hardworking folks, that tell the truth and only the truth. That is why I and so many others support them, their way of life and the legal litigation that will soon commence. http://www.overturn13.org
June 4, 2019 at 1:34 am
I have been adopting since ’96. I took my first girlie to a retired racer’s reunion at Multnomah, and when she heard the bugle, she (and others) wanted to jump off the balcony to have a piece of that again! That is clearly not a memory of abuse.
Granted, when I first adopted, I too believed the lies G2K lies.
After having been involved with my adoption group for years, adopting 10 and fostering 40+, I have not seen one abused dog.
Engage your brains and realize that you can’t abuse an athlete into superior performance, and why would anyone mistreat a ~$70K asset?
June 4, 2019 at 8:06 am
Not sure what that has to do with your court action.
June 4, 2019 at 3:00 pm
Not sure what that has to do? The same thing that you or G2 have to do with any legal moves which are made – nothing. That is the crux I suppose. The persons who wrought this via a fraudulent media campaign left and went home. So now, the media has nothing to do with the next steps. So, like Wayne Gretzky, we take our shot. It may work. It may not. But you accomplished your task. Why on earth do you care what we pursue, how we spend our money or how we choose to handle the future? Your job is done. What difference at this point does it make to you Skippy?
June 4, 2019 at 8:12 am
If I remember right you accused us of buying off the CRC and Pam Bondi, six of the seven Supreme Court Justices and 69% of the voters. Doesn’t that seem just a bit of a stretch to you?
June 4, 2019 at 8:14 am
Proven win or lose the suit? So, what you’re saying is you’re right no matter what anybody else says? Doesn’t that seem just a wee bit off to you?
June 4, 2019 at 8:16 am
I see, So, using that money to help the people and dogs in the industry was never an option, huh?
June 4, 2019 at 8:17 am
Or uncover the truth the industry tried so desperately to hide. Seems like the latter is what the people of Florida saw.
June 4, 2019 at 8:21 am
I think you probably know we are helping. And we’d help more if the industry wasn’t in such of a seventh grade snit about losing and would work with all the groups to help the dogs. But it never really was about the dogs, was it.
June 4, 2019 at 3:03 pm
Who on earth are you replying to? Yourself? Perhaps the 7th grader you mentioned should teach you how to properly utilize technology.
June 4, 2019 at 8:23 am
No one ever told you how much money you could raise. It was your decision. Now you’re raising all thing money for a lawsuit. Why did you wait so long?
June 4, 2019 at 8:39 am
No doubt the federal court will find the non existent greyhound abuse cases Bondi lied about prosecuting very enlightening, fat fred
June 4, 2019 at 9:47 am
It could well be in the cards that gtey2scam will be soliciting donations to pay lawyers after they are charged with criminal acts after this suit runs its course, fat atheist Fred. Perjury is a felony,and no doubt there is more criminality in the past, perhaps it will come to light on the stand. After all, grey2scam has engaged in blackmail in the past.
June 4, 2019 at 1:30 pm
You gotta love these armchair laeyers who know more than real constitutional lawyers
June 4, 2019 at 8:48 am
Fred, you may fashion yourself as a 21st century Cicero but I think you’ll find in the end that the Constitution of the United States of America has no provision for exiling an entire class of people. You did very well in your quest to dupe the voters in Florida. You spent quite a bit of money knowing that pulling heart strings works. Facts didn’t matter to you, just the results mattered to you.
You should be worried, Fred. Greyhound Nation WILL have it’s day in court and no matter what happens in the end, Grey2K, HSUS, and the entire cottage industry of ‘Animal Rights’ will be exposed as the frauds, liars, and lobbyists that you and they truly are.
You spent a fortune in other people’s money while you lied to those very same people. The truth WILL have a very bright light shined on it and you’ll have no place left to hide.
June 4, 2019 at 9:56 am
Wow. Ronnie Williams was non-existent? Ursula O’Donnell was non-existent? All those drug violation documented by the state were non-existent? That’ pretty far out there even for you.
June 4, 2019 at 9:59 am
Actually I consider myself more of a Seneca guy, but I realize Cicero won. That being said though, I think even Cicero would agree your case is facetious on its face, and merit-less when examined.
June 4, 2019 at 10:19 am
Actually Fred you are more like a southbound end of a northbound horse kind of guy. What is your organization doing to help the displaced dogs and workers???? Nothing but going to the other states where greyhound racing is and making mountains out of ant hills.
June 4, 2019 at 4:31 pm
Listen ChickPea, You want to debate the merits of Roman or Greek orators with me? Have at it. But please, refrain from quoting the Ars Amatoria – I just ate lunch. Fancy yourself a Seneca do you? Well here is a bit from Polybius – or better yet Valerius Maximus – though only the true Classicist will have any notion of whom I speak. You can have your Seneca. Figuratively speaking, I prefer the story of Horatius Cocles. Have a good day, Lars. Oh – and for everyone’s sake, Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
June 4, 2019 at 10:01 am
Actually we do support adoption groups and we offered to support after 13 passed, but the industry was in such a seventh grade snit because they lost they refused our help.
June 4, 2019 at 10:05 am
Isn’t Grey2Kscam Steve’s group? Is he in trouble with you guys like Jack Corey? I’m going to need a program to figure out who’s in favor and out of favor on your side. Maybe infighting was one of your problems during the campaign.
June 4, 2019 at 11:10 am
Cannot shut your fat mouth can you Fred, you do nothing for adoption groups, the 2.4 million in salaries proves that, then you beg for donations to buy a printer. ” All those drug tests” which comes out to one tenth of one percent of all drug tests, not statistically relevant. How many more had no canine DNA. Oh its going to be glorious watching your fellow criminals on the stand.
June 4, 2019 at 11:15 am
Oh poor emjay/kierston.
Your complete ignorance is dumbfounding. A defenseless rabbit? At list your response is a glaring representation of how Grey2K and HSUS are so successful with their campaigns of lies and misinformation. I pity you and the untold numbers of others totally devoid of the ability to reason and the faculty required for critical thought. You are a sheep who will be led to the slaughter one day by the very people you believe in. OMG, such a shame.
June 4, 2019 at 1:36 pm
So the guy who used to regulate greyhound racing is also lying about the mistreatment of the animals involved? See here: https://www.miamiherald.com/latest-news/article218244230.html
If you’d like more examples, try a quick Google search.
June 4, 2019 at 2:04 pm
Tony Glover? You mean the guy who is a lobbyist for grey2k? Maybe you should read this article, which was a rebuttal to the one you posted.
June 4, 2019 at 11:41 am
I’ll take that as a yes.
June 4, 2019 at 11:44 am
I’ve written before about the help Grey2K has given groups I’ve volunteered with as well as what’s been told to me by friends and colleagues who volunteer with other groups. That’s as far as I’m going to go though because, first of all, you won’t believe me anyway and second any group I mention by name will be instantly blacklisted.
June 4, 2019 at 12:32 pm
As much as I’d like to see it win, my hunch is that a lawsuit in Florida won’t work out the way we racing supporters want it to. I believe the industry would be better served mobilizing in the states that still race. Dorchak and her minions will surely be headed to one of those next, in order to get their names published and raise their organization’s profile and financial standing while proudly, smugly, putting people out of work.
June 4, 2019 at 4:37 pm
Both are being pursued
June 4, 2019 at 12:36 pm
The governor hasnt signed it yet, and. I guess we will see, attorneys all have differing opinions, and its not like it was put on the ballot through an honest process. One judge did see it our way pal
June 4, 2019 at 1:34 pm
You can pretend all you want for any reason you dream up. It is incorporated into the Florida Constitution. Here is a copy/paste snippet:
Prohibition on racing or wagering on greyhounds or other dogs.
The amendment to Article X, which prohibits the racing of or wagering on greyhound and other dogs, and the creation of this section, shall take effect upon the approval of the electors
There is no Federal due process for invalidating any line items from a state’s constitution. This is the same reason that abortion pro/cons have to deal with the Federal Supreme Court.
June 4, 2019 at 1:41 pm
Um yes there is. Are you a real lawyer or an ambulance chaser? Or is this Don the liar Goldstein?
June 4, 2019 at 2:41 pm
Nope, just someone smarter than you (and your lawyers)
June 4, 2019 at 1:03 pm
Except a 2014 Florida amendment was overturned in federal court, know it all
June 4, 2019 at 1:23 pm
Sorry Andy, that case is not comparable due to constitutional reasons – and you should be honest with yourself first
You are being rather naive
June 4, 2019 at 1:38 pm
Well I am going to leave my LAST comment here which will not shut hot air Fred up but will show any rational thinking person why we are at a lawsuit stage. Keep in mind this is only one out of hundreds of reasons and is out in the public domain, so I am not revealing any litigation strategy, but a LIE is a LIE is a LIE, so here goes.
Remember the company line that the State loses $$$ on regulating greyhound racing???? We heard it ad nauseum and Grey2k and the ilk quotes a loss of 3 million dollars from the farce that was the Spectrum Report in 2013. In 2014 The DBPR head said this in an email to Jack Cory “There is no specific document showing the total cost of greyhound racing”. Fast forward to 2018 and Senator Tom Lee towing the Grey2k animal terrorist line says this to the Commissioners:
“As a result, the State loses money, a
substantial amount of money. Essentially we
are propping up this industry by using other
revenue sources inside of DBPR to fund the
deficiency between the revenue that comes in
off of dog racing and the cost to regulate it
by the tune of somewhere between one million
and $3.3 million today. That number is growing and that is based upon a study that was conducted on behalf of
the Legislature in connection with a recent
committee that I believe was created under
President Gaetz’s presidency in the Senate, to
review parimutuel wagering in Florida.”
-Tom Lee at the CRC 3/20/19
Then Chairman Beruff drops this on Lee:
“CHAIRMAN BERUFF: A follow up question. I did call the Secretary of DPBR, something like that, that one, to ask the question of the financial impacts on the State because I was I took, you know, I listened to the audience as they spoke and how it costs us more to regulate than what it generates and so forth. And I was his answer was, we take in more revenue than it costs to regulate that industry. So it is a little bit different than the what you have said. So I am and I had this discussion, what is today, today is Tuesday, I must have had it Thursday of last week or Friday, so it is very fresh in my mind. So there is a disconnect between what you say and what I saw, so what how, what do you attribute that to?”
I think we know the DISCONNECT is the failure of Fred and anyone at Grey2k and their politician bed buddies to tell the TRUTH.
Now you have but a little taste of why this suit is being filed.
A Man with Common Sense
June 4, 2019 at 2:05 pm
My god these comments are so moronic lol. First off, some of yall need to get a life instead of posting the same garbage over and over again. Its so obvious that pro racing groups are flooding the comments section with the same exact script.
Second, even if this is overturned, greyhound racing is dead in florida (or anywhere in the US) since its not an economically viable business idea. Casinos lost tons of money on it just so they can operate their gambling operations. Its not the 1970s anymore. In 2019 there is so much competition entertainment wise that nobody wants to waste their time at a dog track. The Marlins can barely get people to show up, why in the world do people think that dog tracks can do better?
Also, some people need to get with the times. Racing dogs is a primitive idea. Originally greyhounds are hunting and farm dogs. They need to go back to being pets or back on the farms instead of trying to pay someones mortgage. Its 2019 people, lets find ways to make money without needing to demand on gambling on dogs since that doesnt benefit the world now a days.
June 4, 2019 at 2:53 pm
“A Man With Common Sense” makes a lot of sense. The few pro-racing groupies will have no REAL rebuttal to those facts.
These racetracks want to turn their real estate into much more than oval tracks and kennels. Most have closed on their own regard over the years. Over 70% have closed in the British Isles without any push or legislation. Australia is going down for the second time.
For some, the reality of the situation sucks, time to accept it and move along. Time for greyhounds to start their lives as pets first without working for a few humans for a few years.
June 4, 2019 at 5:13 pm
Man with common sense? I’d question that…….. Horse and dog tracks were there first, then the casino’s came into play, slowly but surely pushing the animals out, refusing to upgrade the facilities or offer a fair share of the betting to the owners/breeders.
If you thinK fighting for these animals and their staff makes me moronic, I proudly wear that badge. Better that than turning a blind eye, while G2K, H$U$, PETA, ASPCA and the rest of the alphabet soup of anti animal activists collect donations under false pretenses, then pay off politicians to further their cause: lying to the public, terrorising farmers, altering pictures & video tapes to further their agenda, did I mention lying???? don’t forget anti animal ownership, eat vegan or get tarred & feathered. How many animals have PETA & HSUS admitted to killing, animals that never had a chance at a good life….. Man Common Sense, you might want to rethink your ideology…… In the meantime, I”ll glad fight for http://www.overturn13.org along side of the folks at Support Working Animals. We have truth on your side, do you???
hannah wake up
June 5, 2019 at 2:16 pm
ya good luck fighting for an amendment that not only wont get overturned but even it does, there is zero demand for greyhound racing. i guess in your world the empty stands and low attendence doesnt exist?
the only reason tracks didnt shut down greyhound racing earlier is due to an outdated law that forced gambling places to keep tracks open. im not sure what is so hard to comprehend about that but if u wanna keep living in your bubble to where money isnt a factor then thats your own stupidity.
June 4, 2019 at 3:11 pm
Let’s please overturn 13 and let these Greyhounds race.
They love to do it and these owners trainers and many more including myself love to be involved in these greyt athletes lives.
This Amendment is so unfair and beyond ridiculous.
Mr.Theil you could benefit by seeking authentic employment and earning money as I and these people involved with Greyhounds do.
You instead collect money from people and manipulate the truth 100% to the general public while padding your pockets at the same time and not helping the Greyhounds you speak of with one of those dollars handed to you from people that believe you.
How can you lie to people and sleep at night …shame on you.
Your statement or comment by the way makes no sense at all.
OVERTURN 13 AND LET THE GREYHOUNDS RUN!
June 5, 2019 at 4:02 pm
Theresa, there are no provisions in the Florida Constitution for overturning a constitutional amendment that has been voted on by a strong majority of citizens – without having another voting amendment that supersedes that one. You have 19 years to wait for that chance. Any politician who even initiates legislation would consider it political suicide since nearly 70% of the voters were clear in their statements. Besides, at this point in time, due to decoupling, the tracks will close by themselves – as many have done so with a sense of urgency. They could not wait to close. They do not even care about a deadline – and you know it.
They do not want your support.
The dogs will be able to run, not to worry. But soon it will be when they want, and as much as they want. Without the regimentation they are used to now. Sure, they love to run. MUCH better in a playful backyard rather than at night on a rock firm schedule
June 5, 2019 at 5:03 pm
19 years, armchair lawyer? Wrong, actually a citizen petition drive could have it on the ballot next year, and every 2 years thereafter. So much for your knowledge.
June 5, 2019 at 11:09 pm
A lot of the people that voted did not even know what 13 was about.
Don’t tell me any different either,these were friends of friends.
Then there were some that did not even vote on it,due to not understanding the stupid @$$ Amendment.
You people are so far up Dorkchaks and Theils rear end they can taste bryl cream.
Good grief,what lobbyists they are,crying about a printer that costs $3500 and start up fees and the projected cost to run it for a year.
Meanwhile they have received over 7 million in donations and need help buying a printer?
Then they never have dropped a dime to help 1 Greyhound as of yet.
Their minions just keep handing them money.
My goodness people wake up.
June 4, 2019 at 3:33 pm
Sorry Stevie. I saw the charts myself. Maybe The quote about TOTAL cost is disingenuous because the issue is oversight cost to the state versus amount contributed to that cost by the industry.
June 5, 2019 at 8:20 am
You saw the charts yourself did you fat atheist fred? You said ALL deaths in May 2018 were racing related, which wasn’t true, once a liar always a liar, of course lying would never bother an atheist, since they are godless. But it sure is going to bother you when the horned, cloven hoofed one comes for you
June 4, 2019 at 3:36 pm
As I said several times, it’s your dime, do what you want. My point was the money might have been better spent helping the adoption groups, or workers transitioning out of the industry.
June 4, 2019 at 4:43 pm
Last word, Freddie
June 4, 2019 at 4:55 pm
I was talking about writing style, but I hope you enjoyed showing off. By the way Semper ubi sub ubi translated to always where under where. Not quite what you were looking for I think. Here’s one that fits you: Caesar si viveret ad remum dareris.
June 4, 2019 at 8:38 pm
Nah, I know my Latin puns. So it is exactly what I was looking for. I can spot a subjunctive from a perfect passive participle, but thanks for playing. My point is that you treat the Greyhound people as less than you; as people who are perhaps not as smart, who are less in your eyes. Your whole group did this first, then followed it up by demonizing them and falsely accusing a rather large group of genuinely good people of criminal abuse. You publicly demonized them and portrayed yourselves as the smart, compassionate saviors who would deliver greyhounds from people you deem unworthy to have them. Truth be told my favorite thing to translate is Petronius. Cena Trimalchionis – the Millionaire’s Dinner Party. I believe it perfectly reflects the behavior, attitudes, and self-importance of a self-absorbed group of Massachusetts lobbyists. Win or lose, perhaps you will all be exposed for the charlatans you are. And if Caesar were indeed alive Freddie, I’d be Sulla. He lost a few – but in the end had the last laugh.
June 5, 2019 at 7:40 am
Well, not quite. In fact, pretty much the exact opposite. If you were to go back and count the number of comments made by the pro-racing side about the people and organizations who were anti-racing, i believe they would far out number the comments they made about the welfare of the dogs. It was (and is) about the people for them. And how could it be otherwise, if you think about it. How does one defend the commodification and exploitation of innocent living creatures for profit? Their only option was to try and kill the messengers. By the way, you do realize that it was Sulla’s actions the destabilized the Roman power structure and led to the demise of the Republic, right?
June 5, 2019 at 7:54 am
How does one defend putting honest hard working people out of the work they love using slander and flat out lies, how does one defend engaging in blackmail, how does one defend 2.4 million in salaries for 6 people then begging for donations for a copier? How does one defend themselves as truth tellers when they are confirmed liars such as you and panty waist thiel’s husband?
On another subject, which infanticide supporting anti Semitic socialist are you supporting that will have their butt handed to them by OUR GREAT PRESIDENT?
June 5, 2019 at 11:33 am
I have never held the sentimentality of a Livy towards the Republic. Luckily Sulla – as you say – paved the way for the Empire. Sweeping away the holier than thou Republic with an Empire which fought hard enough and was scrappy enough to dominate for centuries? I will take that over your self-righteous hand-wringing any day.
June 5, 2019 at 7:54 am
Here is how I sum things up. Some of the tracks the land became more valuable than the business. They couldn’t get decoupling passed through the legislature. Here comes the CRC who got in bed with the animal rights wackos and put the amendment on the ballot without due process and very crafty language to deceive the voters. The amendment passed and we are now challenging it in Federal Court. We also know that Grey2k is a bunch of liars and thieves who pay 40% of their donations in salaries for just 6 full-time employees. We also know that the NGA greyhound is treated like royalty and are adopted out once they are done racing. Finally we all know that Fred Barton is a southbound end of a northbound horse. I’m proud to be fighting to get this sham of an amendment overturned.
June 5, 2019 at 8:14 am
Except for the fact that people will transition out of the industry as it shuts down, your premises are faulty. As far as the workers go, we have always supported attempts to help them. We did so in Iowa and have supported what few suggestions we’ve seen in Florida. Why has nothing been heard from the industry about helping workers? It would seem that, if greyhound racing is one big family, as we have been told, the industry would be in Tallahassee loudly and consistently lobbying legislators for assistance.
June 5, 2019 at 11:35 am
You have been mentioning “transitioning” a great deal here…
June 10, 2019 at 12:54 pm
Good grief, contain your ego. Just because you’re not privy to something doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.
June 5, 2019 at 9:28 am
Craig and Andy write like 2 childish butt-hurt guys who bring up religion and politics. Horrible ambassadors for the pro racing few. Guys, the tracks don’t want you. The bettors don’t need you. The workers don’t need you (scary for them if they did). The dogs don’t need you (they would love to run as loved pets from day 1 rather than thinking the whole world is a track for 4 years). The only thing that needs your desperate childish whining is your egos.
But you don’t get that. Probably never will. Tracks have been closing all over the planet even without legislation. Your ways are old, unneeded and no longer possible. Go revisit the mass dog graves from not to many years ago to understand why you people don’t act properly until pushed.
It’s over. You blew it.
June 5, 2019 at 9:41 am
All that drivel from yet another godless, infanticide supporting weirdo vegan, haven’t heard you mention the 2.4 mil in salaries of your crooked leaders liar goldstein. The fat lady hasn’t sang quite yet, our ways are no longer possible huh, well, then I guess there will be no greyhound racing today, will there? Yet again you lie, we will see what the court case brings, but you being such a great armchair lawyer you already know the outcome, you are all of your fraudster ilk are scum, why hasn’t there been any uproar on the 20 dead dogs that is APSCA’S fault, just further proves your hypocrisy.
Don’t worry about my ego pal, it is, and always has been plenty big, that’s one reason I like Trump and The Nature Boy, I bet you never played sports in your pathetic life, most likely a mama’s boy, right liar goldstein?
June 5, 2019 at 10:19 am
Don the last thing I’m suffering from is butt hurt. Just because I speak the truth about Grey2k and call Fred Barton a southbound end of a northbound horse, doesn’t make me bad for the pro-racing side. You’re as bad as Freddie Barton. My question is where did the mass graves happen? Maybe those graves are from a long time ago before adoption became the norm and were discovered. If the spirt is dying then why is handle up? I will agree that maybe the sport needs to right size itself.
June 5, 2019 at 10:42 am
One of the mass greyhound graves was found on Robert Rhodes’ property in Alabama, very near the Pensacola track. Over 2,000 greyhound bodies were found on the premises in May of 2002 by officials of Florida and Alabama. Before Mr. Rhodes went to trial, he died of a supposed heart attack.
I do believe greyhound adoption groups began in the early 1980’s, so it’s not that greyhound adoption was in near full force (compared to today’s numbers)in 2002.
Mr. Rhodes was supposedly paid $10 per dog to kill them. One of the Florida breeders from whom we often picked up dogs called me (Janet Wood, whose husband Walt had died earlier in the year), crying that she had just been contacted by a Florida official, verifying ear tattoos of one of her dogs that had been found in the grave. The last she knew the hound had been racing in Orlando!
June 5, 2019 at 3:11 pm
I remember the Rhodes case, it gave the anti-racing movement a lot of fuel. That was when more dogs were put down than adopted, but fortunately that percentage has increased to 100 percent.
June 5, 2019 at 3:32 pm
Just like in every other instance with the pro-racing few. Nothing good happens until forced.
June 5, 2019 at 9:32 pm
Don, adoption wasn’t forced, but it does take time to raise awareness to achieve 100 percent. When I did a research paper I saw the adoption percentage grow year over year. I will admit that the industry has done a lot of things to shoot themselves in the foot, but they have changed for the better in the past 30 years and there are changes that still need to be made. But what do I know, I’m just an accountant.
June 5, 2019 at 1:03 pm
LOL Donnie, you better get your ambulance chasers if you get called for the Federal Lawsuit. They won’t be able to help you there, yes the public that made all the criminal accusations but presented no evidence will hopefully be called with the rest of the dirty laundry. Might you be one????? I sure as hell hope so.
June 5, 2019 at 4:11 pm
Steve G., I am not, I do not even live within 2,000 miles of your forsaken state. I was not involved at all in your Florida massacre. I presented nothing to nobody.
I only know who is wrong here. .
Steve, calling me “Donnie” and other childish things only proves one thing: You are a very unprofessional, desperate name caller. And quite insecure. See if you can grow up a bit. Man up.
June 5, 2019 at 7:00 pm
Foolish? At least I’m not giving legal opinions while being clueless about a citizen’s petition drive, at least I’m not making stupid comments about workers getting jobs in casinos that will never exist there Einstein.
Another nugget of info for you, Iowa will run at least through 2022, and we aren’t dead in Florida just yet. Australia has a growing industry.
Yet again again you fail to answer the question, if racing is dying, why is handle rising? Of course is par for the course for you and your ilk, just keep repeating the lies, despite evidence to the contrary.
Federal court could be so emlightening.
June 5, 2019 at 10:36 am
It wasn’t me that said the deaths were racing related, it was the state report that I took the information from.
June 5, 2019 at 10:44 am
Lying again,all the state said was they died, and you said they were ALL racing related. Once a liar always a liar, funny you dont comment on the 2.4 mil in salariws and copier scam
June 5, 2019 at 10:49 am
In a report about greyhound racing deaths the state said they does, so seems like racing related deaths is a fair take away.
June 5, 2019 at 4:39 pm
No, it isn’t a fair take away, it’s your way of slandering honest hard working people. You’re a liar fat fred, simple as that, just like the bs cocaine tests that were one tenth of 1 percent, if it was canine dna at all that is.
Interesting you or your fraudster friends have slammed APSCA for the 20 dead dogs that were in their care, but then they are your partners in crime, like your sister organization ALF.
June 5, 2019 at 1:20 pm
Because it’s inevitable. It has happened in every state that has ended racing. I think there is a responsibility to help those who will need to look for re-training,or new positions, or whatever. In my opinion Iowa was the model for this.
June 5, 2019 at 1:25 pm
Well, our self righteous hand wringing brought down the racing empire in Florida, so there is that.Stultum facit fortuna quem vult perdere.
June 5, 2019 at 3:11 pm
For now. Fortunam citius reperias quam retineas. Same author. Good luck keeping it Freddie. We will fight you every step of the way. And you just never know, do you? Nov 2016 should have taught you that.
June 5, 2019 at 2:20 pm
Craig and Andy – I am in no way affiliated with Grey2K. I have never spoken to any of them, have no need. I have known quite a bit about greyhound racing from the late 60s to the present. Over the years, I’ve spent more time in Wonderland, Taunton, Raynham, Hinsdale, Tijuana, and both tracks in Iowa then you will ever know. I know you are not as knowledgeable as me, so I do not fault you for your butt-hurt-ness. Perhaps you can call me a reformed sinner. Sick of all the BS. As I said before – the industry made grievous errors in the past and did not correct anything until absolutely forced, and inspected by less biased individuals. People know this. Outsiders see your exaggerations, accusations, and misstatements equally as much as they understand that grey2k forcefully makes their points. Some of the things you say ARE childish, very much so.
It does nobody any good to tell you to give it up – it is silly to tell someone stroking their ego to suddenly drop their ego. I can tell from your insulting language, completely wrong guesses, and having people correct you with real facts (see above) that invalidate your comments, that you are just swinging an ax wildly.
Read again for clarity: the tracks don’t want you. The bettors don’t need you. The workers don’t need you. The dogs don’t need you (they would love to run as loved pets from day 1 rather than thinking the whole world is a track for 4 years). You are just helping to pay for your lawyer’s kids college tuition. Carry on, I know you will. And toss your grade-school level insults along the way. It defines you.
June 5, 2019 at 4:43 pm
As if anything a liar like you says can be believed Mr Goldstein. It is you who is on the side of fraudsters and terrorists….. ALF.
June 5, 2019 at 6:22 pm
I can assure you I am not Mr. Goldstein, I have no idea who he is. But keep up the childish comments. Calling people “fat” or “atheist” only distances you further from the real people you *think* you are trying to help.
Remember, read it a bit slower this time: The tracks don’t want you (they don’t! They are closing no matter what any legislature permits). The bettors don’t need you (they don’t! Off-track betting is making you useless than you already are). The workers don’t need you (they don’t, they will all get better higher paying jobs in the casinos). The dogs don’t need you (they would love to run as loved pets from day 1 rather than thinking the whole world is a track for 4 years). And looking at the count of NGA puppies, the breeders have already abandoned you. Matter of fact, their numbers have been crashing for the last few years. Guess why? Go ahead…GUESS WHY. You love to guess, that is all you do!
June 5, 2019 at 6:36 pm
Mr Know It All, useless? I was in the gym at 4am this morning, no doubt you have never been in one, after that I was busy with volunteer work for hurricane victims here. I assure you that you are far more useless than I will ever be.
So, the workers will get better jobs in the casinos, will they? You mean the casinos they can’t build anymore because of the passage of Amendment 3, that was a citizen’s petition drive, which you are obviously know ignorant about.
The more you talk, the more ignorance arises. I really don’t care who you are, but you are on the side of liars and scammers, and if greyhound racing is so ” dying “, why is handle rising? A question posed by Mr Laginess above. Of course you and your criminal ilk don’t care for facts, only bs to pull at heartstrings for donations to pocket.
June 5, 2019 at 7:41 pm
There you go again Andy, using names like a pre-teen. By the way, I am 6 foot, and 188 pounds and run in half-marathons. I have no donations to solicit from anyone, I retired many years ago. I just know how far off-base you are.
Are you trying to quote the old data posted on that tired site that talks about a 7% increase? YOU KNOW – REPEATING OTHER PEOPLE’S LIES MAKES YOU LOOK DOUBLE-FOOLISH.
Why don’t you post very recent data and the source – or just plain old shut up?!
Here – I will even DO IT FOR YOU:
Here is the link from your crappy state.
You need to compare live wagering to live wagering…stop adding in off-track betting to try to deceive people! It is so easy to prove who the REAL liars are! YOU.
Let me give you the information to save you (verify it if you want! I am not the liar here, YOU are).
complete year’s data
2018 – $77,522,797
2017 – $83,468,825
2016 – $87,738,338
want to see how DEAD dog racing has become? Check this out!
2006 – $196,362,449
Dude…..you’re toast…why even try?
Dog racing is near death, it will be dead soon. Those dogs in those mass graves will have their revenge soon!
Besides, it is immaterial what the handle is. The tracks want you OUT.
FACTS FACTS FACTS
June 6, 2019 at 1:48 pm
Well, ah, Mr armchair lawyer, simulcast money goes to the track too, so it counts, people have simply moved to online betting, that is why betting at the track is down, but total handle is UP.
They grey2scam way, leave out facts to make a fraudulent point.
You do half marathons do you, how nice, most likely have spaghetti arms and legs.
Why haven’t you mentioned the citizen’s petition drive or people getting jobs in casinos that will never exist? Because it proves your stupidity, that’s why
June 5, 2019 at 4:04 pm
I have t admit I was expecting Fortuna audaces iuvat, but that’s good to. For my response allow me get get a little more pedestrian with an English proverb from the 1400’s: A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
June 5, 2019 at 4:11 pm
Are we being pedestrian then? Okay. Not if it craps in your hand.
June 5, 2019 at 4:17 pm
Leave it to the pro-racing few to become childish and add in the feces comment. It’s no wonder few listen to your drivel. At least it is better than Craig’s north end/ south end nonsense. He brings it down to the 7th grade level.
June 5, 2019 at 4:37 pm
He called for pedestrianism. The actual Cicero would have loved the North end/South end comment.
June 5, 2019 at 4:56 pm
You know Andy, you threw all these “facts” around all during the campaign, and worked day and night to keep the subject off greyhound racing and on something else–anytime else. It didn’t work. Aren’t you tired of beating this dead horse?
June 5, 2019 at 5:09 pm
Seems to me you wish to keep the subject off the fraud of your scam group, that’s why you won’t mention the 2.4 mil in salaries and the copier scam, just like you would never mention the blackmail grey2scum engaged in in W Va, or your sister organization ALF.
The horse isn’t dead yet, greyhounds race today in FLorida, and they will be racing a year from today. Until the day comes they don’t race, then the fat lady, or fat freddie’s, haven’t sang.
June 5, 2019 at 6:50 pm
Andy, regarding your forecast of dogs racing today: Yes, fewer dogs will be racing today than at any time in recent memory. And next year much fewer dogs will race than today. And 6 months after that, exactly ZERO dogs will race in Florida.
And more than likely at that point the last track in Iowa will already be closed for racing.
And even before that, the two Texas dog tracks (one owner) will probably be closed for live racing. The casinos will all be going strong, and those tracks will be ready for something new.
You just keep leaving yourself open to a factual response that makes you look foolish.
June 5, 2019 at 8:13 pm
Without ADW your statements are fatuous junk.
June 5, 2019 at 9:20 pm
Theresa, why don’t you comment on my 7:41 PM comment to Andy above? See if you can call that fatuous junk.
Just sunk your battleship
June 5, 2019 at 4:56 pm
You can always wash your hand, and you’ve still got the bird.
June 5, 2019 at 8:19 pm
Maybe, maybe not. Since you like the classics, I suggest Odysseus. In the Greek. ὕβρις
June 6, 2019 at 7:54 am
If you want to keep rehashing these old accusations that never went anywhere anyway, have at it. I’m done going over the same ground again and again. The election is over, Andy, move on.
June 6, 2019 at 8:13 am
And who was the only one to recognize Odysseus when he came home? His dog Argus. And what breed was Argus? A greyhound of course. This was before greyhounds became commodities to be used and discarded for profit. A sad time for such a noble breed that was once the companion of kings. Things are looking up though.
June 6, 2019 at 11:13 am
In Greek it is ArgOS not Argus. Yeah. the Greeks didn’t use hounds for hunting, sport, military purposes, flock protection and guardians, right? Canines were working animals then and they are working animals today. Perhaps you don’t realize you proved my point. Hounds including Odysseus’ in ancient Greece were working dogs – undoubtedly hard working dogs. They were a commodity in Greece. And yet, still loyal and faithful companions, appreciated by their owners. Please, point out for me the Homeric word for Greyhound? Because in extant red figure Attic pottery, Argos looks nothing like a greyhound I have seen. Perhaps you draw from modern sources. No matter. The Greeks used their dogs as working animals. It was a symbiotic relationship. Yeah I am sure Greeks just had hounds sitting on their couches LOL. People like you would take centuries of working traits and careful breeding and turn it into an obese caricature of animal perched on your sofa because you believe you know what is best for dogs who have thrived for centuries without your help.
Odyseeus’ dog was likely the typical Laconian, or perhaps the Vertragus, an ancient ancestor of the greyhound who as Martial’s epigrams stated “hunts not for himself but for his master” – YES even then. So nice try but thanks for making the point that the ancestors to Greyhounds, as most working animals, were bred for a purpose. To work, to serve as guardians, herders and hunters. But the narcissism of man today believes that he knows better than centuries of breeding and evolution, and that somehow, those past generations got it all wrong, and they belong a couch.
June 6, 2019 at 1:25 pm
Theresa, why don’t you comment on my 7:41 PM comment to Andy above regarding his lies about the handle increasing? See if you can call that fatuous junk.
Just sunk your battleship
June 6, 2019 at 1:38 pm
Tell you what you do there armchair lawyer who knows not what a citizens petition drive is, not mention people getting jobs in casinos that will never exist. Call up Wheeling, Tri State or Iowa and ask if their handles have increased from 2017.
The lies are on your side, as evidenced by Fred and Dorchak, you know, who has no memory of her ” accident ” until it comes time to tearfully solicit donations.
Tell me, where do all the huge super payoffs come from if it is so dying? I recently saw one for over 35K.
You have already proven your ignorance, perhaps this weekend you should study up on what a citizen’s petition drive is.
June 6, 2019 at 2:18 pm
Andy – I have already proven you wrong. Do I have to do it again? A big payout just means fewer people have gotten winnings. Cash is not invented for a payoff. The same percentage amount goes out in every race.
I am not an armchair lawyer, as I have said before. I am just much smarter than you. Just by me not living in Florida makes me smarter than you!
Iowa will not make it one more year with live racing as their state subsidies have stopped. Terry Branstad saw to that well over a year ago (he’s now the Ambassador to China).
Want a real printout of non-off-track betting handle there Mr. Smarty-Pants? Do you actually believe most of the pap that they tell you? I know you believe the lawyers, why not, it is their payday.
June 6, 2019 at 2:30 pm
I believe anyone over what proven liars say, such as you and the rest of you scum. Iowa gets casino money through 2022, if you were so smart you would kmow that, but of course you arent very smart, as evidenced through your lack of legal knowledge concerning citizen petition drives or people getting jobs in invisible casinos. You have proven nothing, I am quite capable of knowing handle is rising, thats, just another lie you criminals perpetrate, armchair lawyer. Trump 2020
June 6, 2019 at 3:46 pm
Andy. Enjoy Florida. You deserve it.
Enjoy your losses. You’ll eventually learn.
June 6, 2019 at 5:27 pm
Andy, The Citizen’s Petition Drive process was just amended – you’re toast. Get it? Toast. It now has big penalties attached with the new restrictions….got cash?
Besides, the tracks are closing all by themselves.
Remember – they don’t want you and they don’t need you. They want live racing to end also. And they are the real controllers here!
It’s going to happen no matter what anyone wants now! You got owned by your nemesis (look it up). Book it Danno
June 7, 2019 at 12:13 pm
It will need 766,320 signatures, you obviously read up on it after I pointed out how ignorant you are as a armchair lawyer. Yes, it will take a lot of cash, but it’s quite possible we have a couple of big money people or groups on our side there armchair lawyer.
Interesting you don’t mention the invisible casinos that workers will get jobs in, nor do you mention me correcting on IGP.
You are merely a troll, and a ignorant one at that. On the side of liars and blackmailers.
Enjoy my losses? That’s funny considering I do very well at horse and greyhound racing. Do you live in mommy’s basement?
June 7, 2019 at 3:16 pm
Don, It’s interesting and quite rude that you would imply that people living in Florida are stupid. Especially when you and your buddy Fred are bragging about the majority of voters who voted to pass amendment 13.
Carol Lynn Chilton
June 7, 2019 at 4:11 pm
The fact is, in my case, a Florida resident since 1974 (I love living here in sunshine and nice weather year round), that I am extremely tired of the back and forth after the fact of the passage by more than the required majority of voters. Therefore I sparingly comment on the reasons for my YES vote on Amendment 13 because no one commenting here will have rheir mind changed. Regardless here I go: I have been involved in greyhound RESCUE since 1994 when my first greyhound, Bob’s Popsycle, joined my family. I voted YES because of my experiences in picking up foster dogs from Sarasota, Melbourne, Daytona, Sanford-Orlando kennels and from others who raced their dogs at Palm Beach, Nsples-Ft. Myers, Mardi Gras AND a couple of veterinarians who had been given greyhounds to be euthanized AND directly from at least 7 greyhound farms. So each of us have our reasons and all of will have to wait for the (fruitless) adjudication.
June 7, 2019 at 5:01 pm
Carol, glad that you made a somewhat educated vote, even if it was for the amendment. My question is how long ago were your experiences? There have been great strides over the past 30 years regarding the welfare of the dogs. Greyhounds aren’t rescued anymore they are retired and 98 percent adopted out. This amendment not only affects greyhounds, but it will eventually affect all working animals from police dogs to thoroughbred race horses to zoos to AKC dog shows. That is why so many organizations including the Florida Farm Bureau, NRA, AKC, UKC, 102 Greyhound adoption groups, etc. were against the amendment.
June 8, 2019 at 2:49 pm
Sabrina, you need to stop making up things. You are doing YOURSELF a disservice. I never said that people living in Florida are stupid, just that I am smarter than Andy. There are better places for work and retirement and entertainment and weather for sure, but that doesn’t make people in Florida stupid.
Also, I have never met or spoken to Fred. I do not know what he looks like or sounds like. Have no desire or need to. If you don’t believe that, then that is your loss.
Know why you guys lost so badly? You guess at things, then believe them to be facts. That may not be obvious to you, but it is obvious to others.
June 6, 2019 at 3:11 pm
That’s a bit elitist don’t you think? Just because information appears on a link like Yahoo doesn’t automatically make it any less accurate. Can you provide a link that argues Argos was not a greyhound? Like I said, literature is open to interpretation. The word greyhound doesn’t appear in the Odyssey because it hadn’t been invented yet. The word greyhound evolved from Old English grīġhund, a cognate or borrowing of Old Norse.
I would stipulate that some dogs still do what they were bred for, although I would also argue most do not. Additionally, I still believe using a dog for hunting or varmint control is qualitatively different from exploiting it for money. As Argos show us, greyhounds were not bred to race in a for profit industry.
June 7, 2019 at 3:40 am
Everything is “for profit” these days. Just becuz you are earning a wage doesn’t mean you are inhumane.
Why don’t you ask the ASPCA what happened to those 20 dead “rescue” dogs they were transporting? How did they die for a “non profit”? An over heated too crowded poorly vented van?
But it’s ok, it was charity work. Right??
Or is that Fellow – bluster?
June 7, 2019 at 1:43 am
I receive p0st from g2k, aspca, hsus, peta every day. All they are interested in is my money. Same old years of lies. One thing I learned in college law classes was not all attorneys are reputable and you cannot predict or be sure of the courts decision. GREYHOUND STRONG!
June 7, 2019 at 6:43 pm
Greyhound strong; yes – AS A PET. From day 1. Without being told to run on a racetrack’s schedule rather than as a free and loved pet.
Yes, they love to run, and EVERY breed of dog wants to be loved as a pet.
And Marty, does any organization soliciting you for money make them wrong (or right)? Care to debate that with St. Jude’s Children’s Cancer hospital? See how you made a Straw-Man’s argument (and failed at making a point)?
You know as well as me that the court won’t accept service as there was no procedural error or conflict with the federal constitution. If an injunction is issued on this one constitutional amendment, then one will be issued on all of them – and that ain’t happenin’.
Andy and Craig and others who lost; Why don’t you guys use this cash you are compiling to help re-home the dogs? You supposedly support the dogs, right? You guys even claimed that 13,000 dogs would be flooding the rescue groups. Your peers now claim they will rehome all of them, no problem. know what? There is now a SHORTAGE with waiting lists!
I get that you do not like that you lost. Completely lost. Numbers don’t lie. Amazingly the tracks and others are not joining you in this backdoor attempt. At least they are being professional. They know the score. Besides, once again, the tracks don’t want you, the bettors don’t need you, the dogs are celebrating.
June 7, 2019 at 6:55 pm
That was an interesting, if a bit condescending, rant until you spoiled it with your anthropomorphistic true colors at the end. The dogs are celebrating? Talk about a straw man. I won’t event bother with your disingenuous comparison to St.Judes. Your narcissism is truly sickening.
June 7, 2019 at 7:16 pm
Ignorant armchair lawyer is wrong again, that makes 4 times, actually several tracks are helping ignoramus, 1. wrong about petition drive..2. says people will get jobs in invisible casinos…3. Iowa won’t close next year 4. wrong about tracks not helping. If you defended me I would get a new trial for incompetent counsel.
June 7, 2019 at 10:04 pm
Again, I am not a lawyer. I am just smarter than you.
Yes, the dogs are celebrating. They really do celebrate early when they go out as a pet as a puppy and not having to wait 4 years of being chained to a regimented schedule of running at their dark sleep time. Or in the heat, or freezing cold, or driving rain.
Andy, really, a petition? Lol.
Have a family member from a track or two donate a few bucks? More LoLs. Hardly could be called support.
The statewide vote was MORE than a 2 to 1 margin. That’s a statement!
June 7, 2019 at 10:52 pm
You’ve never owned a greyhound have you? Or for that matter, have you ever had any dog as a pet? So now, you tell us that greyhounds are “celebrating” the end of racing. You also tell us that somehow, someway, they are cognizant of the regimen of life as a racing dog and how horrible it is.
Don, if you do have a pet, try interrupting its routine sic regimen. Let’s see how much your dog “celebrates” when you forget to feed him at his accustomed time or pass on its morning walk.
While presuming that you’re “smarter” than everyone else, remember that you’re only as smart as your last sentence.. sheesh, you sure have mixed up a lot of confused thoughts on canine behavior and assigned human emotion to them. I’m sure in your muddled perception of their ability for cognitive thought, they’re eternally grateful to you, Fred, and Christine.
June 7, 2019 at 10:54 pm
Don the amendment does give the PETA wackos a foothold in Florida’s constitution. This court fight is not only about saving greyhound racing in Florida, it’s about working animals in general and the lack of due process given in the CRC hearings. Why did so many non-greyhound organizations voice their opposition against the amendment? Also If you so think that greyhound racing is dying, then let the unprofitable tracks close down. At least Fred Barton has the guts use his real name, unlike you.
June 8, 2019 at 7:38 am
Oh yes armchair lawyer, you are leaps and bounds smarter than me. That is why I had to educate you on citizen’s petition drive, that is why you think track workers can work in an invisible casino, bet they are going to love those invisible paychecks. That is why I know more about IGP than you.
The vote was achieved by outspending the NO side 30-1, and the ads were doctored, with stolen material. If your side is so virtuous, why must they engage in such duplicity?
Carol Lynn Chilton
June 8, 2019 at 1:45 am
Many greyhound rescue groups ~ yes, rescue since the large majority of greyhounds would not have a place to go after racing as most owners & trainers have no personal investment in finding homes for them except to pass them off ~ do the work they do (getting the dogs vetted, doing background checks on applicants, doing home visits, and keeping the dogs as long as necessary) because they believe the hounds would be euthanized if they didn’t and in the interim came to live the breed. Looking at what became of the dogs before rescue groups proves this ~ that they’d be put down. Additionally rescuing greyhounds has become their major social outlet. Any rationally thinking rescue person should love to be “put out of business” because there is no longer a need to work themself to death finding homes for dogs/cats/whatever that are overbred and because of irresponsible breeders (in that too many are bred for a reasonable pace in the process of finding, certainly hoped for, loving & responsible owners). The amendment makes no reference at all to other animal species ~ just the betting on live racing of dogs in Florida.
June 8, 2019 at 2:40 pm
James: please learn to read with cognition. I never said I was smarter than everyone else. Just smarter than Andy. I know him, and I know that I am smarter than him in every way. No matter. I was merely trying to explain to him that I am not a lawyer. However, I am in a position to know where this is going and why.
Craig: As usual, as I corrected you before the election that totally killed live dog racing in Florida by an excessively wide margin, this addresses live dog racing ONLY. No other working-dog activities are mentioned or inferred. In-state RACING.
Due process was followed as the procedures were quite specific and the Florida Supreme Court gave it their blessing. AND the election was certified. Please state what you feel was in violation of a procedure, and state that controlling procedure. If you cannot, then sayonara, as they say.
By the way, My family and I have owned greys since the late 60s, so your guesses and assertions are totally invalid. And yes, I agree things are better now for the breed. But only after being forced by outside groups. Now, more outside groups have stopped your racing. If you say you did not see this coming, then that is just one more reason to doubt yourself, and not cast stones at others. Check out the failures of your peers first.
Yes, the dogs are celebrating. Every single time they poop on their schedule and not some kennel hand’s schedule. I wish my 3 greys had that luxury for their first 4 years. Assuredly all the future greys will! I see the breeders have just about shut down their operations. Reality has already set in
June 8, 2019 at 11:57 pm
So, you lie yet again. You know me? You know nothing about me armchair lawyer. If you are so much smarter than me, why am I the ONE who knew workers could not not possibly work in INVISIBLE casinos? Why am I the one who had to school you on citizen’s petition drive? Why am I the one who knows more about IGP than you? Why am I the one who knows several tracks are actually helping our cause?
It is true the vote was lopsided your way, interesting you never mention the reason for that is that we were outspent 30-1 or your fraudulent side relied on DOCTORED, STOLEN footage. If this does by chance end up in court, I would FAR rather be on our side, the side of TRUTH, than on the side of scammers like you.
In a previous post you made like your side id like St Judes, that is blasphemy, but of course that doesn’t bother the godless.
June 9, 2019 at 1:59 pm
It is okay if you think you are smarter than everyone. You aren’t smarter than me. You see I have enough sense to know ridiculous anthropomorphism and pearl-clutching when I see it. Any person with a modicum of sense would know the average dog lives in a house where both owners work. Most dogs are ALONE the entire day, and they are on their OWNER’S regimented schedule. Perhaps a small percentage live where there is a stay at home parent. But for most pets…Up then out…on the owner’s schedule – usually their owner’s work schedule. Then the dog is often home alone for 8 hours a day while owner’s are at work and kids are at school. In a crate or confined to limited rooms, though perhaps with some run of the house. Alone. Then owner comes home. Dinner – out for a walk and some play Then out before bed, all to repeat again the next day. Say there is a stay at home parent. Oh wait…that means shuttling kids to school, to sports, to practice this or game that…and the dog is dealt with…on the owner’s regimented schedule. These are not bad owners. They are not necessarily unhappy dogs. They have playtime and weekends. But to sit there and say a greyhound is celebrating because it is no longer on a regimented schedule, when it would be on just as much of a schedule in a home is about simplistic and delusional as one could get. Lucky for greyhounds, they have the company of their littermates, their kennel mates, and trainers who often put their dogs before themselves.
As for voting yes because you believe Greyhounds need rescuing Carol…well, I look forward to the massive protests you are organizing at FL animal shelters which euthanize 300K pets a year. Three hundred thousand healthy animals put down a year. I look forward to your demonstrations concerning those shelters. Or would that be, to use your eloquent phrase, fruitless?
Carol Lynn Chilton
June 9, 2019 at 2:46 pm
Personally I can work on only a few things that need help/correction at a time. I have volunteered 15+ years at the local Ronald House, done dog walking at two local animal shelters and one greyhound rescue that has a kennel, done fundraising for same, and I am still working parttime. Fortunately I am able to take my greys to work; before this job of 10+ years, my earlier hounds had full run of the house when I worked full time. Perhaps I will start volunteering at a local shelter once 2021 arrives. In the meantime I will continue rescuing greyhounds ~ for, as previously stated, where would ex-racers and not-qualified greyhounds go? The large majority of breeders, owners and trainers have only provision for passing them off to adoption/rescue groups.
June 9, 2019 at 3:45 pm
Theresa, you present a very distorted view of things. If anyone believes you, then they would want all dogs to be institutionalized for their first quarter of their lives as a necessity for better lives and behavior.
And Andy. Yes…. I have smirked right at you and I can assure you that I am not godless….. Not that any of that matters to this. But you REALLY are grasping for straws, I can’t fathom why you bring up religion or politics.
There is nothing wrong with being out spent. And nothing is stronger legally than a state constitutional amendment that has been validated by a public vote and certified. It “trumps” all other laws.
Where did your accounting buddy go?
June 9, 2019 at 2:24 pm
I’m also looking forward to the massive protests at E-way on-ramps advocating for the 1 million different animals/birds per day killed on our nation’s highways as well as the over 1 million per year deaths of large animals and the 200 per year deaths of humans due to vehicle/animal collisions. Or the protests held at wind farms protesting the needless deaths of countless birds. I suspect I’ll be waiting a long, long time.
June 10, 2019 at 3:28 pm
If you read my comment, you’ll see that I didn’t imply the industry is doing nothing, only that no one seems to have heard anything about what they might do. If you know of any industry sponsored programs to help ex-workers, please let others know. In six months that last track will close and people need to make plans.
June 10, 2019 at 4:25 pm
Proven liar atheist Fred, you wouldn’t know the truth if it bit you in your big fat butt, several tracks have already said they will race until the END, which is Dec 31, 2020, not the end of this year, barring an unsuccessful lawsuit of course. Now go hit the buffet
June 11, 2019 at 9:43 am
Fred the atheist? Hmmm. Arguing with an atheist is not really productive. They will never admit to a power greater than their own savior complex.
June 10, 2019 at 4:45 pm
That’s true. I got ahead of myself there. I still think it’s not to early for programs to help those who will be looking for work. What is the industry doing to help these people?
June 10, 2019 at 5:57 pm
The greyhound industry is doing something for their displaced workers, it’s called a severance package and to think you’re actually educating our youth. The FGA will be filing a lawsuit for reparations, which will cost the State of Florida hundreds of millions, once it’s all said and done. What is Grey2k doing for them or the dogs? Absolutely nothing!!! They will repeat what they did in Arizona.
June 10, 2019 at 10:50 pm
Craig, redress is a stretch in this case because the state is not the ones taking the dogs away. To you that’s confusing, to everyone else, they get it because of the way the amendment is worded. This is not titled land that is forcibly confiscated to make a railway for the common good. Let me give you an analogy: When a state outlaws chlorinated benzenes, they are not charged with giving reparations to the dry cleaners who have machines that can only use chlorinated benzenes. That’s already been through courts elsewhere. Precedents will be cited. Florida has a very unique and extremely specific redress law. Perhaps you are believing that one lawyer who advertises and posts frequently. No matter.
This article 13 was carefully worded. If you want to race your dog, any breed, go ahead. Call your neighbor and tell him you want to course your dog against each other. Knock yourself out. What will soon be totally restricted is in-state gambling on in-state dog racing. That is why this amendment carefully calls itself the “Ban on Wagering on Dog Races Amendment”. You are creating a link that was purposely left absent. Feel free to continue to spend thousands on a dog, keep him/her in Florida and have them run to their heart’s content. It’s pari-mutuel wagering on in-state dog racing that will be illegal. Your gripe is with nearly all the tracks who do not want you there. The people of Florida joined in with them. Being outspent and using your industry’s own data against itself is perfectly legal.
There, I helped you a bit, well, I helped you realize that you do not understand how superficial you are. The few cases where reparations were awarded were quite specific and taken into consideration beforehand.
I know you know about severance!
And Andy – why do you belittle yourself with “buffet” comments? Isn’t that a clear case of the pot calling the kettle black? Go have another beer and relax.
June 11, 2019 at 4:30 am
Here goes armchair lawyer again offering up his BS analysis that he has proven time and again to be clueless about.
Also, armchair lawyer, why do you belittle yourself by continually omitting any reference to the subjects where I have proven my superior intellect? To refresh your limited memory I will list them again….1. Schooling you on citizen’s petition drive, so no, one wouldn’t have to wait 19 years…2.The Gov has NOT signed it..3. Workers getting jobs in invisible casinos….4..IGP running through at least 2022….5. Tracks ARE helping.
I do not drink beer armchair lawyer, I put far too much effort into training to jeopardize my progress with the detrimental use of alcohol, it’s called willpower. Doubtful ” half ” marathoners know much about that. I have never entered into any activity in ” half ” a manner. It’s all or nothing for me. I expect you ‘ half ” in many areas, such as being half right in the BS you spew in these comments.
June 11, 2019 at 1:15 pm
Andy, you *are* way too easy. I guess that lawyer advising you saw that in you too. And if your few supporters believed in what you say, then the breeder’s data would not have ALREADY collapsed. Do you prefer being called “Handy Andy” or “Easy Money”?
You need to sleep better.
June 11, 2019 at 4:44 pm
More inane bloviating from the clueless armchair lawyer. Yet again you do not comment on the 5 incidences where I proved my superior intellect. We get you do not wish to call attention to it, but it reamins fact.
Actually I sleep great, early to bed, early rise, in gym at 4am, yet again, called willpower.
June 11, 2019 at 8:02 pm
1: Citizens petition drive in Florida was just “gilled and gutted” like a fish a few days ago. Nearly powerless to establish a new law with it, downright impossible to overturn a constitutional amendment.
2: The Governor does not have to sign it. It became law upon the election being certified. It is not “awaiting” anything. It is written into the constitution NOW.
3: Most workers with any humanoid skills will be offered jobs in REAL casinos. Obviously, a minimum wage worker who scoops poop out of the turnout yard will get a better job elsewhere. Cashiers et. al. will become cashiers elsewhere. Many people who work evenings at tracks use that job as a 2nd job, they won’t even qualify for unemployment. Watch as they get better pay working at Macys. If you tell me that a kennel worker MUST remain a kennel worker for the rest of their life or they will suffer zero employment – well – you just insulted ALL kennel workers.
4: I never used the initials IGP in any of my posts. You need to read better.
5: Two tracks owner’s families made small donations. It’s just food for attorneys.
There, feel better?
Plus, you need a better memory.
I understand and can see your anger. You lost. You are now grasping at straws. It feels sucky to feel that way. The industry is collapsing all by itself, tracks are closing without any need for legislation. Your era is over, gone with the B&W TVs and rolling down the car windows. You struggle to find links to positive data. Go do a count of the number of tracks closed in the British Isles over the past 10 years with no legislation. Want me to do that for you too?
June 11, 2019 at 9:36 pm
Allow me to clarify each point for you, armchair lawyer.
1. ” Nearly impossible ” is not impossible, and with a majority vote ANY constitutional amendment can be overturned.
2. You said in a previous post, ” amendment SIGNED BY THE GOVERNOR “, to which I pointed out it HASN’T been signed by the governor. Therefore, I am correct and you are WRONG.
3. Yet again, no new casinos are allowed in Florida because of amendment 3, so they will have to get jobs in existing casinos which are few and a hell of a long drive from some tracks. Clearly you were clueless about amendment 3. Again, I am right and you are wrong.
4. I read just fine, you stated ‘ Iowa will close before the Florida tracks do. You were clearly referring to IOWA GREYHOUND PARK, for sake of space I condensed it to IGP ( condense means make smaller). You had no clue concerning IGP’s agreement with the casino, showing your ignorance. Thus, AGAIN. I am right and you are wrong.
5. ” 2 tracks owners made small donations ” Again, wrong. This suit is still in it’s infancy, do not be surprised when sizable donations come our way, a certain billionaire has expressed interest in joining our cause.
I guess you have never hear of an industry bottoming out and making a comeback. 3 current tracks outside Florida are doing well indeed, and plans are afoot in a few other states to have tracks reopen. The bottom line is, Amendment 13 is unconstitutional, it will be decided in Federal Court, and I highly doubt they will look fondly on the crooked CRC process, including the Attorney General flat out lying, along with the rest of the lies. We will see.
Now that I have clarified matters for you, go relax, have a beer, get a good night’s sleep, get up at 330 am and head to the the gym, do not half ass it either, like you do half marathons. Instead, be like The Greatest Professional Wrestler The World Has Ever Known, and BE THE MAN.
June 11, 2019 at 7:09 am
That’s good to hear (if true). I hope it’s a substantial package. Opportunities for re-training would be nice as well.
Comments are closed.